Matt McMahon

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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by wncapp78 » Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:14 pm

D2 King College in Bristol is offering a scholarship to a 6’8” player from right over in SWVa averaging 20 PPG. Who remembers King? (we lost to them at home just in case you don’t remember). But we’re offering a kid from St Louis and it’s his only offer?
I’m being a little facetious about King College but I’m not sold after four years about our talent evaluation.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by Rekdiver » Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:48 pm

I really like Delph. I think he's one that got away from the big boys.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by firemoose » Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:02 pm

Big difference between "talent evaluation" and getting an NLI signed when many other places that offer have a better atmosphere and more support. And it's time to move the recruiting talk to the Lodge where it's supposed to be or this whole thread goes there.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by wncapp78 » Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:15 pm

I suggest better talent evaluation leads to better atmosphere and more support.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by T-Dog » Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:18 pm

Cobb said when hiring Capel that he had "life experience" that was one of the factors. Cobb also said he felt the players wanted Capel, which turned out to be completely untrue.

Heck, Buzz thought McMahon was the guy. He announced Capel for his UNCW staff and not Matt, then reversed course when Cobb made the single-dumbest coaching hire in the last 25 years at App State/



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by firemoose » Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:45 pm

wncapp78 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:15 pm
I suggest better talent evaluation leads to better atmosphere and more support.
And I'm sure that our staff would love for you to tell them how to get some of the guys we've offered who signed elsewhere and are having good careers to sign with App. We've offered plenty of guys and they came for visits that are now playing well elsewhere. So our talent evaluation of them seems to have been fine.

I have no problem with people expressing opinions concerning recruting. But be prepared to be challenged if your opinion is not based on actual data.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by app97 » Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:02 am

firemoose wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:45 pm
wncapp78 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:15 pm
I suggest better talent evaluation leads to better atmosphere and more support.
And I'm sure that our staff would love for you to tell them how to get some of the guys we've offered who signed elsewhere and are having good careers to sign with App. We've offered plenty of guys and they came for visits that are now playing well elsewhere. So our talent evaluation of them seems to have been fine.

I have no problem with people expressing opinions concerning recruting. But be prepared to be challenged if your opinion is not based on actual data.
it's also about evaluating players who fit our system, not just talent alone. I believe Fox and company have done a pretty decent job of that. He even took a formerly seldom used Frank Eaves and made him one of the best shooters/scorers in the conference in year one. He saw the potential and fit him in appropriately. It's the same reason that there aren't lots of Duke players that are also recruited by UNC....different systems require different skill sets and strengths, although occasionally they both try to court the same player.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by appknowledgeispower » Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:23 am

Seattleapp wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:17 am
Yosef84 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:06 am
I think the question is actually why we didn't hire him over Capel. That was the horrible decision that resulted in a rift. I don't think Matt would have been interested in working under Cobb after that (based on rumor).

Fox has done a lot of positive things. I understand the frustration with the on-court results but I still have some hope that we are poised for good things. I don't think we need to take every opportunity to cast dispersions.
Murray State had a losing record last season in mcMahons first season. 22-5 this year. We are still begging for crumbs when we on the rare occasion don’t competely embarrass ourselves on the court. I’d love for us to be good under fox but I’ve yet to see an consistency as a team or an identity for that matter. It’s just frustrating to know that we couldn’t compete in the so con or the big south, much less he sun belt
Incorrect, McMahon took over and went 17-16 in year 1 (coming off loss of player to NBA), 16-17 last season in year 2 (injury bug), year 3 currently 22-5. Please fact check before posting. Much obliged.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by appknowledgeispower » Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:26 am

T-Dog wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:18 pm
Cobb said when hiring Capel that he had "life experience" that was one of the factors. Cobb also said he felt the players wanted Capel, which turned out to be completely untrue.

Heck, Buzz thought McMahon was the guy. He announced Capel for his UNCW staff and not Matt, then reversed course when Cobb made the single-dumbest coaching hire in the last 25 years at App State/
If he had consulted or had any conversation or attended any practices or actually watched games...he would have known the PLAYERS wanted McMahon. This was a move initiated by Jim Deal and Mark Harrill (spelling might be off). It was an awful move.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by agentpaul001 » Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:37 am

I'm still optimistic for this season, but I think next year the program makes a big leap. Forrest has been great as a freshmen (recent shooting struggles aside) and assuming he stays, he'll be the cornerstone of the team for three more years. O'Showen Williams and Isaac Johnson have both played really well too.

Losing Kinney will be disappointing, but Seacat can help fill the void.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by Yosef10 » Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:44 am

^Agreed. With Shabazz, Forrest, Williams, Johnson, Seacat, and the addition of Delph i think next years team can make a major leap. I don’t know the rest of the leagues retuning talent but i could see us finishing in the top 3 of the SBC which would be a nice change.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by Seattleapp » Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:16 pm

appknowledgeispower wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:23 am
Seattleapp wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:17 am
Yosef84 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:06 am
I think the question is actually why we didn't hire him over Capel. That was the horrible decision that resulted in a rift. I don't think Matt would have been interested in working under Cobb after that (based on rumor).
Fox has done a lot of positive things. I understand the frustration with the on-court results but I still have some hope that we are poised for good things. I don't think we need to take every opportunity to cast dispersions.
Murray State had a losing record last season in mcMahons first season. 22-5 this year. We are still begging for crumbs when we on the rare occasion don’t competely embarrass ourselves on the court. I’d love for us to be good under fox but I’ve yet to see an consistency as a team or an identity for that matter. It’s just frustrating to know that we couldn’t compete in the so con or the big south, much less he sun belt
Incorrect, McMahon took over and went 17-16 in year 1 (coming off loss of player to NBA), 16-17 last season in year 2 (injury bug), year 3 currently 22-5. Please fact check before posting. Much obliged.
My bad. Year three he’s 22-5. And we are where? Besides making endless excuses. I’ll root hard for them and hope fox is the answer. I want to see consistency and an identity from this team and I’ve yet to see either



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by Yosef10 » Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:33 pm

Seattleapp wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:16 pm
appknowledgeispower wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:23 am
Seattleapp wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:17 am
Yosef84 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:06 am
I think the question is actually why we didn't hire him over Capel. That was the horrible decision that resulted in a rift. I don't think Matt would have been interested in working under Cobb after that (based on rumor).
Fox has done a lot of positive things. I understand the frustration with the on-court results but I still have some hope that we are poised for good things. I don't think we need to take every opportunity to cast dispersions.
Murray State had a losing record last season in mcMahons first season. 22-5 this year. We are still begging for crumbs when we on the rare occasion don’t competely embarrass ourselves on the court. I’d love for us to be good under fox but I’ve yet to see an consistency as a team or an identity for that matter. It’s just frustrating to know that we couldn’t compete in the so con or the big south, much less he sun belt
Incorrect, McMahon took over and went 17-16 in year 1 (coming off loss of player to NBA), 16-17 last season in year 2 (injury bug), year 3 currently 22-5. Please fact check before posting. Much obliged.
My bad. Year three he’s 22-5. And we are where? Besides making endless excuses. I’ll root hard for them and hope fox is the answer. I want to see consistency and an identity from this team and I’ve yet to see either

Again, McMahon took over a program that has been wildly successful for over two decades straight and their last 5 coaches, other than Tevester Anderson who was 63 at the time he moved on, all landed major jobs after coaching at Murray State. Appalachian has none of the above going for it. I don’t know why App’s situation is being compared to a school who has 2 NCAA tourney appearances since 2010 while we have 2 since....forever. The man has another year on his deal and this years team is an obvious improvement over the past 3 and they should only get better. Rome wasn’t built in a day and neither is a successful basketball program with no history of success.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by swva appfan » Wed Feb 21, 2018 4:09 pm

wncapp78 wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:14 pm
D2 King College in Bristol is offering a scholarship to a 6’8” player from right over in SWVa averaging 20 PPG. Who remembers King? (we lost to them at home just in case you don’t remember). But we’re offering a kid from St Louis and it’s his only offer?
I’m being a little facetious about King College but I’m not sold after four years about our talent evaluation.
Being from the area I can only guess the kid going to King has not seen the talent level the kid from STL has. Having said that... I understand App has taking a hit with recruiting since 2010 however, I cannot help but to look back at all the coaches who have came in after some bad years and turned things around in 1-2 years and believe strongly it can be done in less time than 5 years.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by wncapp78 » Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:38 pm

Talent evaluation is inclusive of signing players that fit the coaching system and can change the culture of losing. I can look at Wofford, UNC Asheville, Furman, watch players who were evaluated, bought into the system, signed and are contributing to winning programs at those schools. Still don’t see that here.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by APPpines » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:14 am

Not only could we have had Matt McMahon ... we could have also hired Pat Kelsey who I believe is about to win his third straight Big South regular season title at Winthrop. Pat Kelsey is going to get a bigtime job soon and he wanted the App job bad. Charlie Cobb is the worst AD in the history of college sports. The Capel hire should go down as the most stupid hire ever in the history of college basketball. I like Coach Fox and I hope he and the Apps can get on a run here at the end and make some noise in the conference tournament. Go Apps !!!!!



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by NattyBumppo'sRevenge » Thu Feb 22, 2018 7:54 am

2nd worst hire is hiring Buzz the 2nd time, because had we not hired him, we'd probably still have Fancher at HC, which I think most people would be happy with considering the past 10 years.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by appgrouch » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:10 am

NattyBumppo'sRevenge wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 7:54 am
2nd worst hire is hiring Buzz the 2nd time, because had we not hired him, we'd probably still have Fancher at HC, which I think most people would be happy with considering the past 10 years.
I think that, "the powers that want to be", if it wasn't Buzz, then we would have targeted someone else and still would have bought out Fancher. "They" thought Fancher wasn't "Big Time" enough for the program and wanted an "ACC Name" coach to take the helm.

Looking at the ON COURT product from Buzz-2, he did everything that we would want a coach to do. Winning Record: Check, Deep run in Conf Tourney: Check, Post Season Invite: Check, Good APR: Check, Leave the cupboard mostly full for next year/coach: Check. An experienced coach could have built upon what Buzz left. We got Capel.


That's what I do. I gripe and I know things.

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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by app97 » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:34 am

wncapp78 wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:38 pm
Talent evaluation is inclusive of signing players that fit the coaching system and can change the culture of losing. I can look at Wofford, UNC Asheville, Furman, watch players who were evaluated, bought into the system, signed and are contributing to winning programs at those schools. Still don’t see that here.
none of those programs have been in a situation remotely similar to what we were in when Fox was hired. Our situation takes some time to dig out of.



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Re: Matt McMahon

Unread post by app97 » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:16 am

app97 wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:34 am
wncapp78 wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:38 pm
Talent evaluation is inclusive of signing players that fit the coaching system and can change the culture of losing. I can look at Wofford, UNC Asheville, Furman, watch players who were evaluated, bought into the system, signed and are contributing to winning programs at those schools. Still don’t see that here.
none of those programs have been in a situation remotely similar to what we were in when Fox was hired. Our situation takes some time to dig out of.
had we hired McMahon after Buzz instead of Capel, and still had a bunch of losing seasons, then your argument might be more valid since UNCA hired coach McDevitt who had been an assistant for 12 years at his alma mater for Eddie Biedenbach, his former coach. However, Biedenbach had been at UNCA for 17 or 18 years, so the continuity was different than our situation. Winthrop has a bball culture, largely because of Gregg Marshall, but has not had any situation with an APR issue or an inexperienced coach like Capel take over. They've had proven coaches. Wofford has had Mike Young forever, therefore lots of continuity and a clean program. I still look to Cobb and the Buzz/Capel situation as the main culprit of our issues. We can only move forward....



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