Silver Lining to CFP selections for Sun Belt

[EastHallApp]

I don't know why people want a G5 school at the table in a 8-team playoff scenario. It would be such a joke. Northern Illinois made the Orange Bowl on a fluke a couple of years ago and Florida State had their second string in the entire second half.

We just need to wait until the P5 gets what they want, an all P5 league, and we can go about taking care of our business.

Try telling that to Boise State and Oklahoma. I seem to remember a G5 winning the Fiesta Bowl a few years ago. Oklahoma was not laughing.

The exception. Not the rule. Let's not kid ourselves. App State will never be on the same level as the top P5 Programs.

Fact: In the BCS era, G5 teams were 5-2 vs. P5 teams in BCS bowls.

Your Northern Illinois example is both cherry-picked and exaggerated IMO. For one, FSU did not have "their second string in for the entire second half"; the score was 17-10 at the end of the 3rd quarter. More importantly, Northern Illinois just wasn't a very deserving team. As you said, they were there on a fluke.There isn't an elite G5 team every year - but some years, there is.

You are correct that App State will never be on the level of the top P5 programs - and yet, there's one G5 spot guaranteed in the major bowls every year. Why not us? Not necessarily in 2015, but eventually.

As far as Boise being the exception to the rule - of course they are. Any highly successful program is. That's the goal for everyone - to be exceptional.

.

Okay so clearly you'd rather wait for that once in a decade moment when we MIGHT could be in a P5 playoff spot. I, on the other hand, know it's a waste of time and energy.

Speaking of cherry picking... How many of those 5 wins from G5 schools are still G5 schools today? I know Utah and TCU are now P5 (as they should be) and Boise has 2 of those wins and we all know they're in a different league.

You are correct that Utah and TCU have moved up, while Boise and UCF are still in G5 leagues. They were all in non-P5 leagues when they won BCS bowls, which is the relevant point. And citing every occurrence of something is literally the opposite of cherry picking, FWIW.

As for a hypothetical G5 playoff vs. a spot in the current New Year's 6 games, I want the best scenario for us that actually exists. If one day that means a G5 playoff, then that's what I'll hope for.

Personally, though, I'd rather see us in a stronger G5 league - whether that means an improved Sun Belt or eventually moving elsewhere - with better tie-ins than we currently have. Yes, even in a best-case scenario, we're never going to be a regular in the major bowl games, let alone the playoff. But if we could appear in appealing bowl games (i.e., those held in destination cities, played against P5 or high-G5 opponents) regularly, with perhaps the occasional shot at a major bowl, I'd find that to be an ideal situation for our program, and a realistic long-term goal.

[APPARJ]

The exception. Not the rule. Let's not kid ourselves. App State will never be on the same level as the top P5 Programs.

Fact: In the BCS era, G5 teams were 5-2 vs. P5 teams in BCS bowls.

Your Northern Illinois example is both cherry-picked and exaggerated IMO. For one, FSU did not have "their second string in for the entire second half"; the score was 17-10 at the end of the 3rd quarter. More importantly, Northern Illinois just wasn't a very deserving team. As you said, they were there on a fluke.There isn't an elite G5 team every year - but some years, there is.

You are correct that App State will never be on the level of the top P5 programs - and yet, there's one G5 spot guaranteed in the major bowls every year. Why not us? Not necessarily in 2015, but eventually.

As far as Boise being the exception to the rule - of course they are. Any highly successful program is. That's the goal for everyone - to be exceptional.

.

Okay so clearly you'd rather wait for that once in a decade moment when we MIGHT could be in a P5 playoff spot. I, on the other hand, know it's a waste of time and energy.

Speaking of cherry picking... How many of those 5 wins from G5 schools are still G5 schools today? I know Utah and TCU are now P5 (as they should be) and Boise has 2 of those wins and we all know they're in a different league.

You are correct that Utah and TCU have moved up, while Boise and UCF are still in G5 leagues. They were all in non-P5 leagues when they won BCS bowls, which is the relevant point. And citing every occurrence of something is literally the opposite of cherry picking, FWIW.

As for a hypothetical G5 playoff vs. a spot in the current New Year's 6 games, I want the best scenario for us that actually exists. If one day that means a G5 playoff, then that's what I'll hope for.

Personally, though, I'd rather see us in a stronger G5 league - whether that means an improved Sun Belt or eventually moving elsewhere - with better tie-ins than we currently have. Yes, even in a best-case scenario, we're never going to be a regular in the major bowl games, let alone the playoff. But if we could appear in appealing bowl games (i.e., those held in destination cities, played against P5 or high-G5 opponents) regularly, with perhaps the occasional shot at a major bowl, I'd find that to be an ideal situation for our program, and a realistic long-term goal.

You cited a record and omitted the fact that 50% of the teams with G5 wins in BCS games are no longer G5 programs. After all, Utah and TCU were all but P5 programs that didn't have an opening and happened to be stuck in G5 conferences. That's close enough to be cherry picking to me. But I digress...

We agree that we want to see App in a stronger league. Sure. I would love to plan a winter vacation in Orlando to see a bowl game.

But above all, I want App to compete in a league where we have a legitimate shot at reaching the top of where we are. Out of 128 FBS schools, only 20-25 have a real shot at competing.

[EastHallApp]

As long as we're dealing in hypotheticals, how would everyone feel about this idea: A 16-team playoff with 10 auto bids (one for each conference champion) and six at-large bids. Would be closer to the concept of the NCAA basketball tournament.

For this year, the field might look something like this:

1) Alabama
16) Georgia Southern

8) Michigan St.
9) Ole Miss

4) Ohio State
13) Marshall

5) Baylor
12) Boise State

3) Florida State
14) UCF

6) TCU
11) Kansas State

7) Mississippi St.
10) Arizona

2) Oregon
15) Northern Illinois

[bigdaddyg]

As long as we're dealing in hypotheticals, how would everyone feel about this idea: A 16-team playoff with 10 auto bids (one for each conference champion) and six at-large bids. Would be closer to the concept of the NCAA basketball tournament.

For this year, the field might look something like this:

1) Alabama
16) Georgia Southern

8) Michigan St.
9) Ole Miss

4) Ohio State
13) Marshall

5) Baylor
12) Boise State

3) Florida State
14) UCF

6) TCU
11) Kansas State

7) Mississippi St.
10) Arizona

2) Oregon
15) Northern Illinois

Interesting but will never happen. Schedules would have to drop back to 11 or even 10 regular season games. Nobody wants to give up an additional home game due to financial hit. The other 100+ schools with little or no prayer of getting in this mix need the revenue. Even if this scenario were possible you are talking 12 regular season games, a bye for everyone (13 weeks), a conference champtionship game for most if not all conferences and then 4 more games for the top 2 teams. How do you factor in bowls? Is the NC game played at the end of January (provided Bowls are kept in tact)? Once you actually list the bottom 8 or so it really looks like blowout city in many of the possible matchups- kind of like the 1v16 big dance first round games. I think that for the most part the top 4 will generally always play out.

Just as an aside, how badly would we beat Nevada, Bowling Green (currently on a 3 game losing streak with all losses blowouts) and Toledo?

[EastHallApp]

You cited a record and omitted the fact that 50% of the teams with G5 wins in BCS games are no longer G5 programs. After all, Utah and TCU were all but P5 programs that didn't have an opening and happened to be stuck in G5 conferences. That's close enough to be cherry picking to me. But I digress...

Have you considered that perhaps those teams are now in major leagues in part BECAUSE they won those games? Utah had been playing football for about 120 years before joining the Pac-12. That's a pretty long time for there to just "not be an opening." TCU was a SWC doormat for decades before it disbanded in the mid-'90s - when the Big XII took half their league, yet for some reason wasn't interested in them.

I would say citing examples of teams that were in smaller conferences, won big games and moved to bigger conferences as a result makes those an even better case study to follow, not a worse one. Even though, again, I agree with you that it's very unlikely App will ever be invited to a P5 league.

[bcoach]

As long as we're dealing in hypotheticals, how would everyone feel about this idea: A 16-team playoff with 10 auto bids (one for each conference champion) and six at-large bids. Would be closer to the concept of the NCAA basketball tournament.

For this year, the field might look something like this:

1) Alabama
16) Georgia Southern

8) Michigan St.
9) Ole Miss

4) Ohio State
13) Marshall

5) Baylor
12) Boise State

3) Florida State
14) UCF

6) TCU
11) Kansas State

7) Mississippi St.
10) Arizona

2) Oregon
15) Northern Illinois

Interesting but will never happen. Schedules would have to drop back to 11 or even 10 regular season games. Nobody wants to give up an additional home game due to financial hit. The other 100+ schools with little or no prayer of getting in this mix need the revenue. Even if this scenario were possible you are talking 12 regular season games, a bye for everyone (13 weeks), a conference champtionship game for most if not all conferences and then 4 more games for the top 2 teams. How do you factor in bowls? Is the NC game played at the end of January (provided Bowls are kept in tact)? Once you actually list the bottom 8 or so it really looks like blowout city in many of the possible matchups- kind of like the 1v16 big dance first round games. I think that for the most part the top 4 will generally always play out.

Just as an aside, how badly would we beat Nevada, Bowling Green (currently on a 3 game losing streak with all losses blowouts) and Toledo?

How do you factor in bowls? In a situation like this it's easy. Get rid of them. Now getting back to the real world the big boys would never allow it. Remember what we did to Michigan? They still haven't recovered. What do you think would happen if GS knocked Bama out in the first round? The big guys would NEVER take that risk.

[hapapp]

We all knew the deal when the decision was made to move up. We all also know that nothing with conference affiliation is etched in stone and year by year everthing is subject to change. From a simple numbers standpoint App may never contend for a NC. Scroll down the list of P5 and G5 schools and realistically look at the household names who will, more than likely never contend for a NC (including UNC and NCSU). I have wondered if a G5 NC would be viable. Some contend that if this were to happen it would be a glorified FCS setup. Guess the argument can go either way. Would a Northern Illinois v App G5 NC make any noise whatsoever nationally like an Alabama v Oregon NC will? Of course not. Do we REALLY wish we were still in the FCS playoffs, other than because we are Jonesing for some football? If we are completely honest, the answer has to be no. Go right now to ESPN.com on the college football page and look for any news regarding the FCS playoffs- nothing! Winning the NC's was awesome and many of us thumped our chests and said "we can beat so and so in the FBS!" Truth is we hit the ceiling. Now we have lots of goals to attain.

Question, what does the lack of FCS news on ESPN's CFB page have to do with anything?

ESPN doesn't cover the G5 either regardless of their playoff/bowl status.

But a playoff system with the G5 would be much more appealing than FCS. Instead of Maine, Coastal and South Carolina State we might play Marshall, UCF and ECU. That would be really cool.

Only point about the lack of any story echos that FCS playoffs don't move the needle outside of the cities where they happen. Just a reality (and I loved the playoffs). A G5 playoff with the possible scenario you suggest would be great and might carry some interest if played up. But it probably won't happen for a long time.

Interesting attendance stats from last Saturday's FCS playoffs (home team):

New Hampshire- 4,021
Chatty- 8,419
Coastal- 5,601
Jacksonville St- 10,832
Illinois St- 5,575
ND State- 18,113 (of course)
E Wash- 7,919
Villanova- 3,113 (wow).

Liberty took 23 busloads of fans to Philly for that game. They clearly outnumbered the home team fans. If you watched any of that game, you would have noticed that it poured rain throughout the contest.

[ASUGoose]

I don't know that being 12-0 would be good enough to be ranked ahead of another G5. Marshall was 11-0 and the knock on them was their CUSA schedule was weak. So how would a 11-0 SB record be perceived? Beating Clemson would help our case but unless we are just blowing the doors off everyone then we may still have the same problem as Marshall.

A 13-0 Marshall team absolutely gets the G5 bid over a two loss Boise St. team. If App runs its table next year they absolutely beat out any G5 conference champ with 2 losses.

Really? Are you sure about that? Marshall was 11-0 going into the WKU game and was still behind a 2 loss Boise St. team.

At that point in the season, Marshall's body of work wasn't complete. Jeff Long said all along that the committee's rankings started fresh each week and was not a running poll like the AP or Coaches poll. See FSU and TCU's movement along with Jeff Long's comment that FSU moved to solid #3 after winning their title game and completing the year undefeated. If Marshall would have won the WKU game and then goes on to defeat La Tech in the championship game, I don't see the committee putting an undefeated Marshall behind a 2 loss Boise St team after they look at the completed full body of work.

[JTApps1]

The exception. Not the rule. Let's not kid ourselves. App State will never be on the same level as the top P5 Programs.

Fact: In the BCS era, G5 teams were 5-2 vs. P5 teams in BCS bowls.

Your Northern Illinois example is both cherry-picked and exaggerated IMO. For one, FSU did not have "their second string in for the entire second half"; the score was 17-10 at the end of the 3rd quarter. More importantly, Northern Illinois just wasn't a very deserving team. As you said, they were there on a fluke.There isn't an elite G5 team every year - but some years, there is.

You are correct that App State will never be on the level of the top P5 programs - and yet, there's one G5 spot guaranteed in the major bowls every year. Why not us? Not necessarily in 2015, but eventually.

As far as Boise being the exception to the rule - of course they are. Any highly successful program is. That's the goal for everyone - to be exceptional.

.

Okay so clearly you'd rather wait for that once in a decade moment when we MIGHT could be in a P5 playoff spot. I, on the other hand, know it's a waste of time and energy.

Speaking of cherry picking... How many of those 5 wins from G5 schools are still G5 schools today? I know Utah and TCU are now P5 (as they should be) and Boise has 2 of those wins and we all know they're in a different league.

You are correct that Utah and TCU have moved up, while Boise and UCF are still in G5 leagues. They were all in non-P5 leagues when they won BCS bowls, which is the relevant point. And citing every occurrence of something is literally the opposite of cherry picking, FWIW.

As for a hypothetical G5 playoff vs. a spot in the current New Year's 6 games, I want the best scenario for us that actually exists. If one day that means a G5 playoff, then that's what I'll hope for.

Personally, though, I'd rather see us in a stronger G5 league - whether that means an improved Sun Belt or eventually moving elsewhere - with better tie-ins than we currently have. Yes, even in a best-case scenario, we're never going to be a regular in the major bowl games, let alone the playoff. But if we could appear in appealing bowl games (i.e., those held in destination cities, played against P5 or high-G5 opponents) regularly, with perhaps the occasional shot at a major bowl, I'd find that to be an ideal situation for our program, and a realistic long-term goal.

You cited a record and omitted the fact that 50% of the teams with G5 wins in BCS games are no longer G5 programs. After all, Utah and TCU were all but P5 programs that didn't have an opening and happened to be stuck in G5 conferences. That's close enough to be cherry picking to me. But I digress...

We agree that we want to see App in a stronger league. Sure. I would love to plan a winter vacation in Orlando to see a bowl game.

But above all, I want App to compete in a league where we have a legitimate shot at reaching the top of where we are. Out of 128 FBS schools, only 20-25 have a real shot at competing.

How can you write-off the fact that both of them were outside of the power conferences when they won these games? Are you going to say Boise State's Fiesta Bowl win doesn't count any longer if the Big 12 expands and adds them? At what point do you say a G5 team win is legit? What if ECU had finished strong and gone to the Peach Bowl? Would you say they are basically a P5 since they average 45,000 fans? It can be a slippery slope to start saying this team is not really G5, but that team over there is a G5.

Do i think we will ever be in a P5 conference? No way, but we do have a chance to make a Big 6 Bowl if everything falls in place under the current rules. That should be our goal every year. It would take a 12-0 or 11-1 record, but it is possible considering some of the schedules we have lined up.

[APPARJ]

You cited a record and omitted the fact that 50% of the teams with G5 wins in BCS games are no longer G5 programs. After all, Utah and TCU were all but P5 programs that didn't have an opening and happened to be stuck in G5 conferences. That's close enough to be cherry picking to me. But I digress...

Have you considered that perhaps those teams are now in major leagues in part BECAUSE they won those games? Utah had been playing football for about 120 years before joining the Pac-12. That's a pretty long time for there to just "not be an opening." TCU was a SWC doormat for decades before it disbanded in the mid-'90s - when the Big XII took half their league, yet for some reason wasn't interested in them.

I would say citing examples of teams that were in smaller conferences, won big games and moved to bigger conferences as a result makes those an even better case study to follow, not a worse one. Even though, again, I agree with you that it's very unlikely App will ever be invited to a P5 league.

Never in the history of college football has a school been invited to a P5 conference because of one win. Utah and TCU are schools with hundreds of millions of dollars in the bank, located in cities with millions of residents that used their vast resources to build strong programs.

Boise is actually the best example of this. You can count on one hand the number of football programs that have been more successful than Boise over the last ten years and they still aren't in a P5 conference. They don't have the money, market or resources to hang with the big boys.

[APPARJ]

Fact: In the BCS era, G5 teams were 5-2 vs. P5 teams in BCS bowls.

Your Northern Illinois example is both cherry-picked and exaggerated IMO. For one, FSU did not have "their second string in for the entire second half"; the score was 17-10 at the end of the 3rd quarter. More importantly, Northern Illinois just wasn't a very deserving team. As you said, they were there on a fluke.There isn't an elite G5 team every year - but some years, there is.

You are correct that App State will never be on the level of the top P5 programs - and yet, there's one G5 spot guaranteed in the major bowls every year. Why not us? Not necessarily in 2015, but eventually.

As far as Boise being the exception to the rule - of course they are. Any highly successful program is. That's the goal for everyone - to be exceptional.

.

Okay so clearly you'd rather wait for that once in a decade moment when we MIGHT could be in a P5 playoff spot. I, on the other hand, know it's a waste of time and energy.

Speaking of cherry picking... How many of those 5 wins from G5 schools are still G5 schools today? I know Utah and TCU are now P5 (as they should be) and Boise has 2 of those wins and we all know they're in a different league.

You are correct that Utah and TCU have moved up, while Boise and UCF are still in G5 leagues. They were all in non-P5 leagues when they won BCS bowls, which is the relevant point. And citing every occurrence of something is literally the opposite of cherry picking, FWIW.

As for a hypothetical G5 playoff vs. a spot in the current New Year's 6 games, I want the best scenario for us that actually exists. If one day that means a G5 playoff, then that's what I'll hope for.

Personally, though, I'd rather see us in a stronger G5 league - whether that means an improved Sun Belt or eventually moving elsewhere - with better tie-ins than we currently have. Yes, even in a best-case scenario, we're never going to be a regular in the major bowl games, let alone the playoff. But if we could appear in appealing bowl games (i.e., those held in destination cities, played against P5 or high-G5 opponents) regularly, with perhaps the occasional shot at a major bowl, I'd find that to be an ideal situation for our program, and a realistic long-term goal.

You cited a record and omitted the fact that 50% of the teams with G5 wins in BCS games are no longer G5 programs. After all, Utah and TCU were all but P5 programs that didn't have an opening and happened to be stuck in G5 conferences. That's close enough to be cherry picking to me. But I digress...

We agree that we want to see App in a stronger league. Sure. I would love to plan a winter vacation in Orlando to see a bowl game.

But above all, I want App to compete in a league where we have a legitimate shot at reaching the top of where we are. Out of 128 FBS schools, only 20-25 have a real shot at competing.

How can you write-off the fact that both of them were outside of the power conferences when they won these games? Are you going to say Boise State's Fiesta Bowl win doesn't count any longer if the Big 12 expands and adds them? At what point do you say a G5 team win is legit? What if ECU had finished strong and gone to the Peach Bowl? Would you say they are basically a P5 since they average 45,000 fans? It can be a slippery slope to start saying this team is not really G5, but that team over there is a G5.

Do i think we will ever be in a P5 conference? No way, but we do have a chance to make a Big 6 Bowl if everything falls in place under the current rules. That should be our goal every year. It would take a 12-0 or 11-1 record, but it is possible considering some of the schedules we have lined up.

I don't write off their wins. However, not all G5 schools are created equal. For example, SMU is G5 right now but with the resources and money they have, would anyone be surprised if one day they could be P5 material? I wouldn't be.

[EastHallApp]

You cited a record and omitted the fact that 50% of the teams with G5 wins in BCS games are no longer G5 programs. After all, Utah and TCU were all but P5 programs that didn't have an opening and happened to be stuck in G5 conferences. That's close enough to be cherry picking to me. But I digress...

Have you considered that perhaps those teams are now in major leagues in part BECAUSE they won those games? Utah had been playing football for about 120 years before joining the Pac-12. That's a pretty long time for there to just "not be an opening." TCU was a SWC doormat for decades before it disbanded in the mid-'90s - when the Big XII took half their league, yet for some reason wasn't interested in them.

I would say citing examples of teams that were in smaller conferences, won big games and moved to bigger conferences as a result makes those an even better case study to follow, not a worse one. Even though, again, I agree with you that it's very unlikely App will ever be invited to a P5 league.

Never in the history of college football has a school been invited to a P5 conference because of one win. Utah and TCU are schools with hundreds of millions of dollars in the bank, located in cities with millions of residents that used their vast resources to build strong programs.

Boise is actually the best example of this. You can count on one hand the number of football programs that have been more successful than Boise over the last ten years and they still aren't in a P5 conference. They don't have the money, market or resources to hang with the big boys.

Note the phrase "in part."

Of course you are right about the other factors you mentioned (though Boise did join the AQ Big East, right before it disbanded). I assume by "hang with the big boys" you are referring to finances, since clearly Boise has been "hanging with the big boys" on the field for quite a few years now.

Regardless, I would suspect Boise likes their position much better right now than they would playing for a G5 "national championship."

[APPARJ]

You cited a record and omitted the fact that 50% of the teams with G5 wins in BCS games are no longer G5 programs. After all, Utah and TCU were all but P5 programs that didn't have an opening and happened to be stuck in G5 conferences. That's close enough to be cherry picking to me. But I digress...

Have you considered that perhaps those teams are now in major leagues in part BECAUSE they won those games? Utah had been playing football for about 120 years before joining the Pac-12. That's a pretty long time for there to just "not be an opening." TCU was a SWC doormat for decades before it disbanded in the mid-'90s - when the Big XII took half their league, yet for some reason wasn't interested in them.

I would say citing examples of teams that were in smaller conferences, won big games and moved to bigger conferences as a result makes those an even better case study to follow, not a worse one. Even though, again, I agree with you that it's very unlikely App will ever be invited to a P5 league.

Never in the history of college football has a school been invited to a P5 conference because of one win. Utah and TCU are schools with hundreds of millions of dollars in the bank, located in cities with millions of residents that used their vast resources to build strong programs.

Boise is actually the best example of this. You can count on one hand the number of football programs that have been more successful than Boise over the last ten years and they still aren't in a P5 conference. They don't have the money, market or resources to hang with the big boys.

Note the phrase "in part."

Of course you are right about the other factors you mentioned (though Boise did join the AQ Big East, right before it disbanded). I assume by "hang with the big boys" you are referring to finances, since clearly Boise has been "hanging with the big boys" on the field for quite a few years now.

Regardless, I would suspect Boise likes their position much better right now than they would playing for a G5 "national championship."

We all know how much on the field success gets you in college football (UNCC to CUSA, anyone?) so yes, I am referring to finances.

Also, I'm sure Boise likes their position now. Unfortunately, there are 59 other G5 football programs that begin every year with zero shot at a national title. I'm not sympathetic to Boise's plight so much that I would be willing to stick it out in world competing with P5 schools so Boise can have a better shot. I wouldn't be shocked if Boise joined a P5 conference. If they do, awesome. But I really don't care that much.

[EastHallApp]

So basically, I guess what we're debating here is essentially the FCS/FBS move redux: compete for national titles at a formally designated lower level, or compete within the existing two-tiered FBS system and try to rise as high as you can, with the reality that a national title is likely never a plausible result.

The main difference being that this time, it's not a matter for App to decide its own path, but simply to wait for the larger system to sort itself out and then just see where we land.

[APPARJ]

So basically, I guess what we're debating here is essentially the FCS/FBS move redux: compete for national titles at a formally designated lower level, or compete within the existing two-tiered FBS system and try to rise as high as you can, with the reality that a national title is likely never a plausible result.

The main difference being that this time, it's not a matter for App to decide its own path, but simply to wait for the larger system to sort itself out and then just see where we land.

Correct. App State has ZERO power here.

I've mentioned a lower level playoff system a few times. But if we found ourselves playing in a conference championship game with a chance to play a team like SMU, ECU or Boise in a bowl game, I'd be content. Why? Because as long as App State is winning, I'm happy. I just think winning a tournament settles the score. No one argues who was the best FCS team in the land from 2005 - 2007.

[bcoach]

So basically, I guess what we're debating here is essentially the FCS/FBS move redux: compete for national titles at a formally designated lower level, or compete within the existing two-tiered FBS system and try to rise as high as you can, with the reality that a national title is likely never a plausible result.

The main difference being that this time, it's not a matter for App to decide its own path, but simply to wait for the larger system to sort itself out and then just see where we land.

Correct. App State has ZERO power here.

I've mentioned a lower level playoff system a few times. But if we found ourselves playing in a conference championship game with a chance to play a team like SMU, ECU or Boise in a bowl game, I'd be content. Why? Because as long as App State is winning, I'm happy. I just think winning a tournament settles the score. No one argues who was the best FCS team in the land from 2005 - 2007.

That is why I will never be content with a bowl game. A bowl game is great as the chance to see another game but it proves nothing. I hate the thought that we would never again be able to prove we are the best at our level. I do understand what you are saying though.

[ASUGoose]

Recent article on Big 12 not looking to expand to 12 teams.

"The conference is seeking to deregulate the FBS rule that requires leagues to have at least 12 teams and two separate divisions in order to stage a conference championship game. He said there hasn't been any noticeable resistance to that effort yet, that he expects the process to play out within the next six months and that the ACC is also seeking to have the rule removed.

"John Swofford and I have socialized it among the 10 FBS commissioners and there have been a few questions and there hasn't been any significant opposition to it," Bowlsby said."

We all know the Sun Belt would support this deregulation...

http://espn.go.com/college-football/sto ... 10-schools