Bubas Cup 17 May - Final for 2014-2015

[McLeansvilleAppFan]

I have been doing updates each week that included sports standings at that point in time. I have also been including some other stats in the mix. Nothing trumps the actual Bubas Cup points, but one can take an average and include all the SB sports or just those that a particular school sponsors. The average point method does not say everything about a school as some sports give 6 points to the conference champ and others give 11 points, and most sports are in-between.

Though very unofficial, of course, but to make each sport have equal weight, I set up a Unity Point system. I did this by dividing the points earned by the points possible for that sport. Each championship school gets 1.0 points and coming in the middle of the pack gives a school 0.5 points. Total Unity Points will favor (over regular Bubas points) a team that has earned championships in sports like MSOC that only give out 6 points. One can also look at Unity Point Averages to see where a school's average placement in standings occurred. This can be done by dividing by 18 sports and essentially giving one spot worse that the last place finishing team to any schools that do not sponsor the sport. One can also look at the average Unity Points using only the SB sports that a school sponsored. This can give a good indication of how a school did in the SB sports they sponsored. This last option is also going to make schools that don't sponsor as many sports look a lot better.

In a sentence, App averaged 7th place out of 11 overall by most any measure.

Comparing to GaSo we had more points, but we needed to pick up one spot in the standings in 11 sports to tie GaSo in average place standing. Or we needed to puck up about 2/3 of a place standing if we take all 18 sports into consideration.

I don't have financial numbers for every school but it would be interesting to get a Bubas Point per dollar spent average, or Unity Point per dollar spent. That would show who is getting the most bang for their buck.



Total Points
South Alabama 106.0
Texas State 104.5
Texas-Arlington 104.0
Louisiana-Lafayette 97.5
Arkansas State 89.0
Georgia State 85.0
Appalachian State 80.5
Troy 78.0
Georgia Southern 71.0
Arkansas-Little Rock 62.5
Louisiana-Monroe 60.0
Hartwick (Associate) 6.0
New Jersey Inst of Tech (Associate) 3.0
Idaho (Associate) 2.5
New Mexico State (Associate) 2.5
Howard (Associate) 1.0

Total Unity Points
South Alabama 10.93
Texas-Arlington 10.46
Texas State 10.41
Louisiana-Lafayette 9.66
Arkansas State 8.74
Georgia State 8.42
Appalachian State 8.13
Troy 8.11
Georgia Southern 7.11
Arkansas-Little Rock 6.04
Louisiana-Monroe 5.86
Hartwick (Associate) 1.00
New Jersey Inst of Tech (Associate) 0.50
Idaho (Associate) 0.23
New Mexico State (Associate) 0.23
Howard (Associate) 0.17

Average Unity Points
South Alabama 0.607
Texas-Arlington 0.581
Texas State 0.578
Louisiana-Lafayette 0.537
Arkansas State 0.485
Georgia State 0.468
Appalachian State 0.452
Troy 0.450
Georgia Southern 0.395
Arkansas-Little Rock 0.336
Louisiana-Monroe 0.326


Average Unity Points Per Sun Belt Sport Sponsored.
Texas-Arlington 0.747
Texas State 0.651
South Alabama 0.643
Louisiana-Lafayette 0.604
Georgia State 0.601
Arkansas State 0.583
Georgia Southern 0.508
Troy 0.507
Arkansas-Little Rock 0.465
Appalachian State 0.452
Louisiana-Monroe 0.366

[Wally]

I also had fun following the Bubas Cup this year. I was disheartened a little in the overall performance of AppState over the majority of the 18 sports. I fully expect sports like baseball to be better in the near future, but man we are not representing in tennis and the guys are not giving us much in golf or soccer... hope those programs improve! We did not win any of the 18 sports listed and really only performed very well in 3 (football and men's and women's cross country). I did a simple average of the points earned and we ended up in 10th of 11th place... good thing we play in all 18 sports... that helped us move up to 7th in overall.

Rank Total Points Avg Points
UT Arlington 104.0 7.4
Texas State 104.5 6.5
South Alabama 106.0 6.2
UL Lafayette 97.5 6.1
Ga. State 85.0 6.1
Arkansas State 89.0 5.9
Ga. Southern 71.0 5.1
Troy 78.0 4.9
UALR 62.5 4.8
App. State 80.5 4.5
UL Monroe 60.0 3.8

[hapapp]

I also had fun following the Bubas Cup this year. I was disheartened a little in the overall performance of AppState over the majority of the 18 sports. I fully expect sports like baseball to be better in the near future, but man we are not representing in tennis and the guys are not giving us much in golf or soccer... hope those programs improve! We did not win any of the 18 sports listed and really only performed very well in 3 (football and men's and women's cross country). I did a simple average of the points earned and we ended up in 10th of 11th place... good thing we play in all 18 sports... that helped us move up to 7th in overall.

Rank Total Points Avg Points
UT Arlington 104.0 7.4
Texas State 104.5 6.5
South Alabama 106.0 6.2
UL Lafayette 97.5 6.1
Ga. State 85.0 6.1
Arkansas State 89.0 5.9
Ga. Southern 71.0 5.1
Troy 78.0 4.9
UALR 62.5 4.8
App. State 80.5 4.5
UL Monroe 60.0 3.8

Proof that football drives the bus. Our overall athletic program adds little to to the Belt. Hopefully, some of our other sports will step up with the added level of competition we now face. It should be noted that on the academic side our teams do represent us well.

[Saint3333]

One year sample size, don't be so down.

Fox has us headed in the right direction, WBB will also improve. I am concerned about baseball with Billy leading though.

[WataugaMan]

I am concerned about baseball with Billy leading though.

Concur

[hapapp]

One year sample size, don't be so down.

Fox has us headed in the right direction, WBB will also improve. I am concerned about baseball with Billy leading though.

Our athletic program's strength has always been based on the number of teams we sponsor not the number of championship teams. I have always felt that we have appeared stronger than we are because of our numbers and our membership in the SoCon. I do agree that this year was a bit of an outlier and I'm optimistic that Fox and company will have mens bball on the upswing.

[Saint3333]

One year sample size, don't be so down.

Fox has us headed in the right direction, WBB will also improve. I am concerned about baseball with Billy leading though.

Our athletic program's strength has always been based on the number of teams we sponsor not the number of championship teams. I have always felt that we have appeared stronger than we are because of our numbers and our membership in the SoCon. I do agree that this year was a bit of an outlier and I'm optimistic that Fox and company will have mens bball on the upswing.

Not really, App won over 140 conference championships while a member of the SoCon, the next closest had ~100. I had this exact discussion with a UTC fan on AGS a couple years ago.

We knew the SBC was a step up in football, but really it is a step up in every sport. We will adjust and be in the top half of the conference in most sports soon. Although I do worry about baseball, men's golf, and men's soccer (we will have to add a member to keep the NCAA bid in soccer).

[hapapp]

One year sample size, don't be so down.

Fox has us headed in the right direction, WBB will also improve. I am concerned about baseball with Billy leading though.

Our athletic program's strength has always been based on the number of teams we sponsor not the number of championship teams. I have always felt that we have appeared stronger than we are because of our numbers and our membership in the SoCon. I do agree that this year was a bit of an outlier and I'm optimistic that Fox and company will have mens bball on the upswing.

Not really, App won over 140 conference championships while a member of the SoCon, the next closest had ~100. I had this exact discussion with a UTC fan on AGS a couple years ago.

We knew the SBC was a step up in football, but really it is a step up in every sport. We will adjust and be in the top half of the conference in most sports soon. Although I do worry about baseball, men's golf, and men's soccer (we will have to add a member to keep the NCAA bid in soccer).

We'll just agree to disagree. The So Con overall is a weak league. Outside of football, no App teams showed any real consistent strength outside of the conference. I am hopeful that the increased level of competition will spur improvement across the board.

[Saint3333]

Now you are changing the debate to the strength of the SoCon. We all agree the SBC is better.

[hapapp]

I said early on (in my first response to you) that it was the combination of the number of teams and our membership in the SoCon that gave the appearance of a strong program. No doubt what appealed to the Belt was our football program not our overall program.

[Saint3333]

I said early on (in my first response to you) that it was the combination of the number of teams and our membership in the SoCon that gave the appearance of a strong program. No doubt what appealed to the Belt was our football program not our overall program.

Hap that is true for every conference decision made in the last 5 years other than the Big East programs.

Football drives the bus and conference affiliation decisions.

Heck even GA St. and UNCC decisions were made because of football when they either sucked or didn't have a team.

Conference affiliation is driven by:

Football
Media Market for football
Facilities (weighted for football)
Budgets




Basketball





Baseball




Women's basketball




Random sport needed to get to minimum number for NCAA bid

[McLeansvilleAppFan]

I also had fun following the Bubas Cup this year. I was disheartened a little in the overall performance of AppState over the majority of the 18 sports. I fully expect sports like baseball to be better in the near future, but man we are not representing in tennis and the guys are not giving us much in golf or soccer... hope those programs improve! We did not win any of the 18 sports listed and really only performed very well in 3 (football and men's and women's cross country). I did a simple average of the points earned and we ended up in 10th of 11th place... good thing we play in all 18 sports... that helped us move up to 7th in overall.

Rank Total Points Avg Points
UT Arlington 104.0 7.4
Texas State 104.5 6.5
South Alabama 106.0 6.2
UL Lafayette 97.5 6.1
Ga. State 85.0 6.1
Arkansas State 89.0 5.9
Ga. Southern 71.0 5.1
Troy 78.0 4.9
UALR 62.5 4.8
App. State 80.5 4.5
UL Monroe 60.0 3.8

I am glad you enjoyed the weekly updates. I hope to continue to do this for the coming year and maybe even make this a bit more of a formal part of YC/MMB.

I would put about 0% concern in avg points per sport since the manner in which the SB does points is not equal for every sport. Winning MSOC gave a school 6 points. Football was 11 points. It really is apples and oranges. The Unity points I was doing I do think is a better method for comparing schools as I forced each sport to be worth the same value for winning the sport and scaled from there. That had us a bit better. Not great and certainly not great by SoCon standards but still decent enough for our first year in what is a better conference overall.

Here is the spreadsheet again with a new link. It includes all sorts of data, some valid and some not so much.



For historical purposes here is the link to the SoCon cups from the start of the cups in the late 60's to the year we left. I am missing some sports from the 1970s but no one seems to have any records of this, and those sports are no longer SoCon sponsored (swimming for one.)

[McLeansvilleAppFan]

One year sample size, don't be so down.

Fox has us headed in the right direction, WBB will also improve. I am concerned about baseball with Billy leading though.

Our athletic program's strength has always been based on the number of teams we sponsor not the number of championship teams. I have always felt that we have appeared stronger than we are because of our numbers and our membership in the SoCon. I do agree that this year was a bit of an outlier and I'm optimistic that Fox and company will have mens bball on the upswing.

Though not true every year, we actually won many SoCon Commish Cups not only due to having more sports, but the average finish was better than any other school. There are a few years were we won, one or both cups, due to the number of sports we offered but is was rarer than not for this to be the case.

Looking at the modern SoCon era (1982 and more recent), we left the SoCon with the best or 2nd best overall average for sports comparing schools that had been in the SoCon for more than 4 years.