Another student death

App74 · Unread post by **App74** » Thu Nov 20, 2014 6:22 am

Yet another student dies, another family tragedy. What is going on?

http://www.journalnow.com/news/state_re ... 96940.html

appbio91 · Unread post by **appbio91** » Thu Nov 20, 2014 9:13 am

Sad, I don't know what's going on. Unattended death is a new term for me, seen it in both of the recent deaths.

Very sad time.

firemoose · Unread post by **firemoose** » Thu Nov 20, 2014 11:31 am

appbio91 wrote:Sad, I don't know what's going on. Unattended death is a new term for me, seen it in both of the recent deaths.

Very sad time.

It's a PC way of saying they believe, from preliminary evidence gathered, that it appears to be a suicide. It means they don't believe anyone else was there (unattended) and that it doesn't look like natural causes (evidence of suicide). Have to wait for the official word to come from the ME but every one I've been on has been pretty clear. You just can't say it until it's official. If it's not pretty clear then you usually say unknown (speaks for itself) or suspicious (something looks wrong and needs lots more investigation).

I've seen this type of pattern many times. Especially in suicides where it gets all over the news and is covered everywhere, and it pushes those who were already close to the edge over it. Happens in mass shootings also, as we've seen the clusters of them happen. It's sad but if people don't ask for help and those around them don't see signs, don't know what to watch for, or just miss them then it catches people off guard. In most cases the signs seem clear enough afterwards but not at the time.

It's so unfortunate and I can clearly remember every one I've responded to. I really wish people would ask for help as we are the only ones who truly know what is going on inside our minds. But many people see it as a weakness and are afraid to say anything or just don't understand what's wrong until that one things pushes them over the edge. There are always exceptions such as a reaction to medication or just spur of the moment things that happen that can cause someone to snap. Those are classed as impulse suicide and not a thought out event but mostly they are long term plans. We'll know once the toxicology report gets back but all signs right now point to suicide.

Unread post by **Yosef** » Thu Nov 20, 2014 11:33 am

firemoose wrote:
appbio91 wrote:Sad, I don't know what's going on. Unattended death is a new term for me, seen it in both of the recent deaths.

Very sad time.
It's a PC way of saying they believe, from preliminary evidence gathered, that it appears to be a suicide. It means they don't believe anyone else was there (unattended) and that it doesn't look like natural causes (evidence of suicide). Have to wait for the official word to come from the ME but every one I've been on has been pretty clear. You just can't say it until it's official. If it's not pretty clear then you usually say unknown (speaks for itself) or suspicious (something looks wrong and needs lots more investigation).

I've seen this type of pattern many times. Especially in suicides where it gets all over the news and is covered everywhere, and it pushes those who were already close to the edge over it. Happens in mass shootings also, as we've seen the clusters of them happen. It's sad but if people don't ask for help and those around them don't see signs, don't know what to watch for, or just miss them then it catches people off guard. In most cases the signs seem clear enough afterwards but not at the time.

It's so unfortunate and I can clearly remember every one I've responded to. I really wish people would ask for help as we are the only ones who truly know what is going on inside our minds. But many people see it as a weakness and are afraid to say anything or just don't understand what's wrong until that one things pushes them over the edge. There are always exceptions such as a reaction to medication or just spur of the moment things that happen that can cause someone to snap. Those are classed as impulse suicide and not a thought out event but mostly they are long term plans. We'll know once the toxicology report gets back but all signs right now point to suicide.

Good info but I did not mean to like your post. Nothing to like about this.

firemoose · Unread post by **firemoose** » Thu Nov 20, 2014 11:56 am

Understand and completely agree. I know others on here can do the same but I just wanted to give the perspective of someone who has seen way too many of these situations, both from a LEO and an EMS perspective. No one ever wants to respond to a DOA call. We do this to try and save lives and when there is nothing you can do from the beginning that makes it even harder. In well more than 20 years I've known just about every way someone can pass but suicide and any death involving a child is the hardest. But you have to learn to accept and move past or you can't and shouldn't be doing the job in the first place. It sounds cold to say that but it's really not. If the job bothers you too much then you can't do it. If it doesn't bother you at all then you shouldn't do it. You have to be able to find the balance of dealing with what happens, accepting that you did all you could do, and move on. If you can't find that balance it will eat you up inside. I learned that after my first DOA call from a 20+ year EMS veteran. And it's advice I pass on to every new responder I work with.

McLeansvilleAppFan · Unread post by **McLeansvilleAppFan** » Thu Nov 20, 2014 10:09 pm

firemoose wrote:Understand and completely agree. I know others on here can do the same but I just wanted to give the perspective of someone who has seen way too many of these situations, both from a LEO and an EMS perspective. No one ever wants to respond to a DOA call. We do this to try and save lives and when there is nothing you can do from the beginning that makes it even harder. In well more than 20 years I've known just about every way someone can pass but suicide and any death involving a child is the hardest. But you have to learn to accept and move past or you can't and shouldn't be doing the job in the first place. It sounds cold to say that but it's really not. If the job bothers you too much then you can't do it. If it doesn't bother you at all then you shouldn't do it. You have to be able to find the balance of dealing with what happens, accepting that you did all you could do, and move on. If you can't find that balance it will eat you up inside. I learned that after my first DOA call from a 20+ year EMS veteran. And it's advice I pass on to every new responder I work with.

My sister works at a hospital and she asked one of the doctors she assists how he copes. She told me he said, "self medication." In this case...the good doctor drinks a good bit.