What happens if Citadel beats Furman this weekend?

[tim88791]

Article in Charlotte Observer stated that a Citadel win over Furman this coming weekend would tie them with Samford and give Wofford a bye in the playoffs. Can someone chime in to clarify please? Thanks

[mtnjax]

Samford beat Citadel, so i believe they would win the tie-breaker for that spot. Mr. C posted on AGS that last weekend, they (media) pulled out the SoCon tie-breaker rules in the box at Paulson Stadium and he believes that Samford winning this past weekend gives App the auto-bid since Samford is going to be the 4th place team

[87ASUgrad]

Article in Charlotte Observer stated that a Citadel win over Furman this coming weekend would tie them with Samford and give Wofford a bye in the playoffs. Can someone chime in to clarify please? Thanks

I was confused too. If you read tdog's "The Perils of Everyweek Existence: Campeones and Siestas" on the home page of Yosef's Cabin it explains it all at the end of his article (Thanks tdog). El Cid wins and Stink gets the auto bid. Furman sucks, but Go Furple.

[AppState89]

Samford beat Citadel, so i believe they would win the tie-breaker for that spot. Mr. C posted on AGS that last weekend, they (media) pulled out the SoCon tie-breaker rules in the box at Paulson Stadium and he believes that Samford winning this past weekend gives App the auto-bid since Samford is going to be the 4th place team

I believe you are correct. I might be wrong, but I don't think it matters what happens this weekend. If Chat beats Elon this weekend, I believe Chat will be the 4th place team (tied with Sam, but Chat beat Sam head to head).

**If Chat get beat by Elon,,,,Go to 2 below (Sam will be in 4th place not 5th)

ASU, GSU, Woff all beat each other...
1-Chat wins Saturday....they will be in 4th place (beat Samford and Cit)
--- ASU, GSU and Woff beat Chat
STILL TIED
2-Samford will be in 5th place (Sam beat Woff)
---ASU and GSU beat Sam, putting Woff OUT

****ASU beat GSU and ASU gets the auto bid****

I think I'm correct on that.

[TheMoody1]

Article in Charlotte Observer stated that a Citadel win over Furman this coming weekend would tie them with Samford and give Wofford a bye in the playoffs. Can someone chime in to clarify please? Thanks

Getting the auto bid has nothing to do with getting a first round bye.

[85gradinATL]

The Moody is right. I don't think we had the auto bid in '07. It was pointed out that 6 of the 7 teams ranked ahead of us (although rankings shouldn't be taken as gospel) have FBS or tough games this weekend so there's even a chance we could get a seed. Our record with attendance, even for the playoffs, will always give us an edge if we're very close with another team.

[DaphneUrquhart]

There are three things at play here that many folks seem to be getting jumbled.

First, there's the SoCon auto-bid. All the tie-breaker rules are for determining who gets the auto-bid. That is the only (strictly speaking) SoCon guaranteed team in the playoffs. Of course, we'd like to have the auto-bid because that means we're not lumped into a giant glob of teams who aren't auto-bid teams to see which ones get to be in the playoffs.

Then there's the issue of being seeded. The top five teams are seeded (next year when the field expands to 24 teams with 11 AQ teams, the top eight will be seeded). Those seeds are important because seeded teams get home field advantage in the playoffs. Yes, it would be possible not to get the auto-bid and still be a seeded team.

Finally, there's the issue of home field advantage for the non-seeded teams. This is where the money factor comes in. Each school has to send in its bids for the various playoff rounds. Essentially, each team says, "If you'll let us play in our own playground, we'll give you $X." Appalachian routinely is able to guarantee a larger take to the NCAA since our crowds are larger.

So...
1 - Do we get the auto-bid? Perhaps; perhaps not.
a - If we aren't the SoCon auto-bid, will we make the playoffs? Probably.
2 - Will we be seeded? Perhaps; perhaps not.
3 - If we aren't seeded, will be get to play at home? I'd guess we probably would.
4 - Is it great to be a Mountaineer? APPsolutely!

[biggie]

Only first 5 teams are seeded, rest will be playing based on 1st rd bye or not, then the NCAA bids for home field.

The autobid is technically the 'winner' of the SoCon. So could play into the heads of the committee on seeding.

I currently don't believe we deserve a seed, but if a lot of the ones ranked ahead of us lose (and lose badly to FBS teams) and we get the autobid, it could put us in position for a 4-5 seed. Its all just a big guessing game.

I remember us losing a spot or two in polls after the Florida game to end the year, GSU could have the same thing happen.

[YesAppCan]

Correct biggie... 8 teams play Thanksgiving weekend "play-in" games... 12 teams get bye that week.

[AppAlum1]

Samford beat Citadel, so i believe they would win the tie-breaker for that spot. Mr. C posted on AGS that last weekend, they (media) pulled out the SoCon tie-breaker rules in the box at Paulson Stadium and he believes that Samford winning this past weekend gives App the auto-bid since Samford is going to be the 4th place team

I believe you are correct. I might be wrong, but I don't think it matters what happens this weekend. If Chat beats Elon this weekend, I believe Chat will be the 4th place team (tied with Sam, but Chat beat Sam head to head).

**If Chat get beat by Elon,,,,Go to 2 below (Sam will be in 4th place not 5th)

ASU, GSU, Woff all beat each other...
1-Chat wins Saturday....they will be in 4th place (beat Samford and Cit)
--- ASU, GSU and Woff beat Chat
STILL TIED
2-Samford will be in 5th place (Sam beat Woff)
---ASU and GSU beat Sam, putting Woff OUT

****ASU beat GSU and ASU gets the auto bid****

I think I'm correct on that.

I was with you all the way down to the head-to-head, ASU > GSU. The rules do not say you go back to a head-to-head. I think (but I am by no means certain) that after you weed Wofffie out (b/c Sammie beat Woffie), then you compare GSU's and ASU's records with the other teams from best to worst. Unfortunately, GSU & ASU beat & lost to the same teams here. So, it should go to "fewest points allowed" & GSU gets it.

However, this is so screwed up & the rules are so unclear, that the SoCon AQ may have to be decided by either the US Supreme Court, or a very formal game of rock-paper-scissors. I can't wait.

Oh yeah. One more point. The rules are silent as to "fewest points allowed" in what ... could mean in head-to-heads, in conference games, or all season long. Heck, it could mean avg. GPA here ... GSU DEFINITELY WINS IF THAT'S IT!!!

[T-Dog]

The rules are absolutely vague. I did get confirmation about the autobid tiebreaker and put it in my article this week. Basically if Furman beats Citadel, we get the auto, but if Citadel beats Furman, GSU gets the autobid.

Autobids have 0% to do with who gets a first round bye or where a team is placed in the playoffs. It just means they're in.

Basically all teams with a certain record are grouped together. So regardless of who beat who, ASU, GSU and Wofford's records will be put against the teams that finished 5-3, 4-4, 3-5, 2-6, 1-7 and 0-8 in order.

I don't agree with it, but it was confirmed in the Game Notes this week.

[AppAlum1]

The rules are absolutely vague. I did get confirmation about the autobid tiebreaker and put it in my article this week. Basically if Furman beats Citadel, we get the auto, but if Citadel beats Furman, GSU gets the autobid.

Autobids have 0% to do with who gets a first round bye or where a team is placed in the playoffs. It just means they're in.

Basically all teams with a certain record are grouped together. So regardless of who beat who, ASU, GSU and Wofford's records will be put against the teams that finished 5-3, 4-4, 3-5, 2-6, 1-7 and 0-8 in order.

I don't agree with it, but it was confirmed in the Game Notes this week.

OK, who did you get confirmation from? Who writes the Game Notes?

[appvette]

I assumed there was no chance that we would get a seed until looking at the upcoming games this Saturday. We are ranked 8th and out of the 7 teams ahead of us:

2 have likely losses coming to FBS teams.
4 have very tough FCS games
1 has a likely win vs. FCS

We need both teams to lose to their FBS opponents and Montana, JMU, and Towson to win (or at least two of three)


1. North Dakota State Bison 9-1 - Illinois state #11 - Should get a seed even with a loss
2. Montana State Bobcats 9-1 - Montana (rival) - Only played one good team (EWU) and lost to them at home
3. Sam Houston State Bearkats 8-2 - Texas A&M #7 FBS - Likely only 7 D1 teams and zero quality wins
4. Old Dominion Monarchs 9-1 - JMU # 13 - Tough game coming up. A win will likely get them a seed.
5. Eastern Washington Eagles 8-2 - Will probably beat Portland state - Beat a terrible FBS team and lost to a terrible FBS team and an average FCS team
6. Georgia Southern Eagles 8-2 - Will probably lose to Georgia
7. New Hampshire Wildcats 8-2 - Towson #19 - Tough game coming up. A win might get them a seed.
8. Appalachian State 8-3 - Bye - Chance at autobid, 8 D1 wins, 2 quality OOC wins against Montana and Coastal Carolina which will probably make the playoffs. Beat the #1 team at their house. FBS loss against a bowl team. Citadel blowout hurts chances at seed.

[MountainMan]

Do losses to ranked FBS teams really matter at all? I don't think those losses have much bearing unless you lose 88-0 or from a practical standpoint if you loss players due to injuries.

[T-Dog]

The human polls have very little effect on the polls. The playoff committee uses a version of the BCS formula.

[McLeansvilleAppFan]

, 2 quality OOC wins against Montana and Coastal Carolina which will probably make the playoffs. Beat the #1 team at their house. FBS loss against a bowl team. Citadel blowout hurts chances at seed.

Is Montana considered a quality win this year? Compared to Sav St, sure, but they are off this year.

[ASUMountaineer]

Samford beat Citadel, so i believe they would win the tie-breaker for that spot. Mr. C posted on AGS that last weekend, they (media) pulled out the SoCon tie-breaker rules in the box at Paulson Stadium and he believes that Samford winning this past weekend gives App the auto-bid since Samford is going to be the 4th place team

I believe you are correct. I might be wrong, but I don't think it matters what happens this weekend. If Chat beats Elon this weekend, I believe Chat will be the 4th place team (tied with Sam, but Chat beat Sam head to head).

**If Chat get beat by Elon,,,,Go to 2 below (Sam will be in 4th place not 5th)

ASU, GSU, Woff all beat each other...
1-Chat wins Saturday....they will be in 4th place (beat Samford and Cit)
--- ASU, GSU and Woff beat Chat
STILL TIED
2-Samford will be in 5th place (Sam beat Woff)
---ASU and GSU beat Sam, putting Woff OUT

****ASU beat GSU and ASU gets the auto bid****

I think I'm correct on that.

I was with you all the way down to the head-to-head, ASU > GSU. The rules do not say you go back to a head-to-head. I think (but I am by no means certain) that after you weed Wofffie out (b/c Sammie beat Woffie), then you compare GSU's and ASU's records with the other teams from best to worst. Unfortunately, GSU & ASU beat & lost to the same teams here. So, it should go to "fewest points allowed" & GSU gets it.

However, this is so screwed up & the rules are so unclear, that the SoCon AQ may have to be decided by either the US Supreme Court, or a very formal game of rock-paper-scissors. I can't wait.

Oh yeah. One more point. The rules are silent as to "fewest points allowed" in what ... could mean in head-to-heads, in conference games, or all season long. Heck, it could mean avg. GPA here ... GSU DEFINITELY WINS IF THAT'S IT!!!

The rules are vague. With that said, it doesn't make sense to me to implement a three-team tiebreaker, eliminate a team, and then continue with the three-team tiebreaker. It seems logical to eliminate one team, and then revert back to the two-team tiebreaker. I'm not saying that because it would benefit ASU, I'm saying that because it's logical.

Now, I'm not naive enough to think that logic reigns supreme. So, I am not posting this to disagree, but to complain about the vagueness of the SoCon's tiebreaker rules.

[App90]

At this point what has been used in the past is this GPI, I dont agree with it. It really does not show how good teams are at the end of the season. This has ASU at 13, if they use this, look for ASU to possibly have a first round by, then have a tough seed at home. They brag on their site how the FCS playoff committee requests it. I think its really not accurrate this year. GSU's body of work is right on par with ASU even before the UGA game...But they are ranked 5th. No way. Maybe after UGA blasts GSU then it will change. 1 week left may resolve this. But this is inferior. If CC is on the committee this year, if enough of us email him pointing this out he may bring this up.

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