Would you be happy with 8-4, if?

[NewApp]

Interesting. The CW on here just a few short years ago was to drop Field Hockey. I agree with your choice, however.

[APPdiesel]

I don’t necessarily think we need to move to AAC. We were in the NY6 conversation coming out of the disrespected Sunbelt. If App can stay where we are and one or two other schools can elevate (Louisiana is a year away and any of GS, GSU, or stAte could be 2 years away) it’ll go a long way to help our conference perception. I don’t care much for what fans of other conferences think about us, I care what the AP and CFP voters think of us. The only reason to chase AAC is money but it puts us in a worse geographically scattered situation.

[EastHallApp]

We have the on-field football product to compete at the top of the AAC right now. It's everything else that needs to grow.

Ideal next step, IMO, would be regional realignment with SB/CUSA. Reduce travel costs, play more conference games against opponents fans care about and in areas we recruit. Use that stretch to continue to grow fan support, improve infrastructure and get our finances in better shape so that when an opportunity to move up does present itself, we're ready to compete long-term.

[t4pizza]

I see no reason to anticipate that we would average 8-4 in any G5 conference. We haven't averaged 8-4 since I came to App in 1988. We have a football culture and know how to win games and conference titles and I don't think that would change in any G5 conference. I have said it all year, I just don't think the AAC is that much better than the Sun Belt. They have a 2-3 more good teams, but I wouldn't classify that is much better. And with all the talk about better bowl tie ins, of the 7 they have only 2 are with FBS and they are crappy FBS teams, the other 5 are G5s so I really am not sure I would call that a much better bowl tie in. So to answer the question, no I would not be happy with an 8-4 average record in the AAC. Frankly, I think that is beneath App State Football as it currently stand and has stood since at least 1988. I am not trying to sound like an arrogant fan here at all. I just know how we compete against peer schools in our own conference and that sure isn't with an 8-4 record. If we make the move, there may be a couple season of adjustment (although I don't think so unless it corresponded with new coaching change and a large departing senior class) but after that I would expect to contend for the conference title every year just like we have basically done since 1988 with a few exceptions.

[NewApp]

I see no reason to anticipate that we would average 8-4 in any G5 conference. We haven't averaged 8-4 since I came to App in 1988. We have a football culture and know how to win games and conference titles and I don't think that would change in any G5 conference. I have said it all year, I just don't think the AAC is that much better than the Sun Belt. They have a 2-3 more good teams, but I wouldn't classify that is much better. And with all the talk about better bowl tie ins, of the 7 they have only 2 are with FBS and they are crappy FBS teams, the other 5 are G5s so I really am not sure I would call that a much better bowl tie in. So to answer the question, no I would not be happy with an 8-4 average record in the AAC. Frankly, I think that is beneath App State Football as it currently stand and has stood since at least 1988. I am not trying to sound like an arrogant fan here at all. I just know how we compete against peer schools in our own conference and that sure isn't with an 8-4 record. If we make the move, there may be a couple season of adjustment (although I don't think so unless it corresponded with new coaching change and a large departing senior class) but after that I would expect to contend for the conference title every year just like we have basically done since 1988 with a few exceptions.

Which poster said we could "average" 8-4? I personally posted that it wouldn't be surprising if we fielded a few 8-4 seasons here and there. Geez, ECU would be thrilled at this point to even achieve ONE 8-4 season. LOL

The rest of your post seems more or less realistic, if being pretty darn optimistic, as well. (a good thing)

[bcoach]

No

[NewApp]

No

Then do you, bcoach, think we should stay where we are at least for the short term?

[APPdiesel]

Which poster said we could "average" 8-4? I personally posted that it wouldn't be surprising if we fielded a few 8-4 seasons here and there. Geez, ECU would be thrilled at this point to even achieve ONE 8-4 season. LOL

The rest of your post seems more or less realistic, if being pretty darn optimistic, as well. (a good thing)

The OP asked about 8-4. It's in the title of the thread. And I believe it was a question not a prediction.

[NewApp]

Which poster said we could "average" 8-4? I personally posted that it wouldn't be surprising if we fielded a few 8-4 seasons here and there. Geez, ECU would be thrilled at this point to even achieve ONE 8-4 season. LOL

The rest of your post seems more or less realistic, if being pretty darn optimistic, as well. (a good thing)

The OP asked about 8-4. It's in the title of the thread. And I believe it was a question not a prediction.

Point was, I don't think ANY poster said anything about "averaging" 8-4, certainly not the title., I think I can read and interpret as well as you. Maybe wrong, but hasn't been proven otherwise on this board.

[APPdiesel]

NewApp the way you worded your question it sounded like you were referring to and attacking someone for predicting 8-4 when it was purely hypothetical.

Anyone who flat out predicts the 10+ win seasons continue in a tougher league has more hubris than I'm willing to display. We recovered quickly after a rough 2013 and 2014. Maybe that would happen again after a move to AAC, maybe it wouldn't. We'd certainly be set up to carry over that level of success IF we moved this year but a) we aren't moving this year, and b) we've got an unproven head coach so anything could happen.

I'll never bet against the Mountaineers but I'm smart enough to realize the transition isn't guaranteed to go perfectly.

[NewApp]

NewApp the way you worded your question it sounded like you were referring to and attacking someone for predicting 8-4 when it was purely hypothetical.

Anyone who flat out predicts the 10+ win seasons continue in a tougher league has more hubris than I'm willing to display. We recovered quickly after a rough 2013 and 2014. Maybe that would happen again after a move to AAC, maybe it wouldn't. We'd certainly be set up to carry over that level of success IF we moved this year but a) we aren't moving this year, and b) we've got an unproven head coach so anything could happen.

I'll never bet against the Mountaineers but I'm smart enough to realize the transition isn't guaranteed to go perfectly.

Then we agree, diesel. Wholeheartedly.

And actually I was saying the opposite about 8-4. I'm expecting to have a few 8-4's or even worse if we move up to a tougher conference. Like EZU has.

[APPdiesel]

NewApp the way you worded your question it sounded like you were referring to and attacking someone for predicting 8-4 when it was purely hypothetical.

Anyone who flat out predicts the 10+ win seasons continue in a tougher league has more hubris than I'm willing to display. We recovered quickly after a rough 2013 and 2014. Maybe that would happen again after a move to AAC, maybe it wouldn't. We'd certainly be set up to carry over that level of success IF we moved this year but a) we aren't moving this year, and b) we've got an unproven head coach so anything could happen.

I'll never bet against the Mountaineers but I'm smart enough to realize the transition isn't guaranteed to go perfectly.

Then we agree, diesel. Wholeheartedly.

And actually I was saying the opposite about 8-4. I'm expecting to have a few 8-4's or even worse if we move up to a tougher conference. Like EZU has.

Right! We're certainly capable, but I can't brazenly put myself in the "I see no reason why we wouldn't win 11 in the AAC" crowd.

The Sunbelt is on the come up. People who know, know both App and Louisiana are really good. AP voters and playoff committee members will reward that by having two Sunbelt programs ranked at the same time. When that happens we will have pulled even with the AAC.

[bcoach]

No

Then do you, bcoach, think we should stay where we are at least for the short term?

I am not crazy about the Sun Belt but that is who would take us. If there were a better conference for us that would be fine with me. My point is that 8-4 would never make me happy regardless of conference. Would I trade winning for being in a difference conference? My answer would be no. I want to win and we should do that wherever we are.

[t4pizza]

I see no reason to anticipate that we would average 8-4 in any G5 conference. We haven't averaged 8-4 since I came to App in 1988. We have a football culture and know how to win games and conference titles and I don't think that would change in any G5 conference. I have said it all year, I just don't think the AAC is that much better than the Sun Belt. They have a 2-3 more good teams, but I wouldn't classify that is much better. And with all the talk about better bowl tie ins, of the 7 they have only 2 are with FBS and they are crappy FBS teams, the other 5 are G5s so I really am not sure I would call that a much better bowl tie in. So to answer the question, no I would not be happy with an 8-4 average record in the AAC. Frankly, I think that is beneath App State Football as it currently stand and has stood since at least 1988. I am not trying to sound like an arrogant fan here at all. I just know how we compete against peer schools in our own conference and that sure isn't with an 8-4 record. If we make the move, there may be a couple season of adjustment (although I don't think so unless it corresponded with new coaching change and a large departing senior class) but after that I would expect to contend for the conference title every year just like we have basically done since 1988 with a few exceptions.

Which poster said we could "average" 8-4? I personally posted that it wouldn't be surprising if we fielded a few 8-4 seasons here and there. Geez, ECU would be thrilled at this point to even achieve ONE 8-4 season. LOL

The rest of your post seems more or less realistic, if being pretty darn optimistic, as well. (a good thing)

The original post talked about the "norm" being 8-4. The word "norm" is known to mean, usual, typical or standard. I used the term "average" because if 8-4 is the usual, typical or standard season than that can easily be inferred to be an average season. And yes, I am generally optimistic (with good reason) when it comes to App State Football.

[NewApp]

No

Then do you, bcoach, think we should stay where we are at least for the short term?

I am not crazy about the Sun Belt but that is who would take us. If there were a better conference for us that would be fine with me. My point is that 8-4 would never make me happy regardless of conference. Would I trade winning for being in a difference conference? My answer would be no. I want to win and we should do that wherever we are.

Ditto!

[NewApp]

I see no reason to anticipate that we would average 8-4 in any G5 conference. We haven't averaged 8-4 since I came to App in 1988. We have a football culture and know how to win games and conference titles and I don't think that would change in any G5 conference. I have said it all year, I just don't think the AAC is that much better than the Sun Belt. They have a 2-3 more good teams, but I wouldn't classify that is much better. And with all the talk about better bowl tie ins, of the 7 they have only 2 are with FBS and they are crappy FBS teams, the other 5 are G5s so I really am not sure I would call that a much better bowl tie in. So to answer the question, no I would not be happy with an 8-4 average record in the AAC. Frankly, I think that is beneath App State Football as it currently stand and has stood since at least 1988. I am not trying to sound like an arrogant fan here at all. I just know how we compete against peer schools in our own conference and that sure isn't with an 8-4 record. If we make the move, there may be a couple season of adjustment (although I don't think so unless it corresponded with new coaching change and a large departing senior class) but after that I would expect to contend for the conference title every year just like we have basically done since 1988 with a few exceptions.

Which poster said we could "average" 8-4? I personally posted that it wouldn't be surprising if we fielded a few 8-4 seasons here and there. Geez, ECU would be thrilled at this point to even achieve ONE 8-4 season. LOL

The rest of your post seems more or less realistic, if being pretty darn optimistic, as well. (a good thing)

The original post talked about the "norm" being 8-4. The word "norm" is known to mean, usual, typical or standard. I used the term "average" because if 8-4 is the usual, typical or standard season than that can easily be inferred to be an average season. And yes, I am generally optimistic (with good reason) when it comes to App State Football.

Sorry. I didn't notice the word "norm."

[spacemonkey]

i think with our culture and tradition if we did it the right way in terms of recruiting and consistency, we could be very successful eventually in an upper tier conference. Personally, i dont want to go anywhere unless its a P5 or AAC. Other than that, I love the Sunbelt. Sunbelt took us in with open arms and we have had amazing season after amazing season...5 bowls, conference titles, its freaking crazy what we've accomplished. I think the Sunbelt is absolutely better than CUSA and the MAC top to bottom and I'm proud of our conference

If I were Sunbelt powers...I would change the scheduling agreement to have 4 divisional games. App, Georgia State, Georgia Southern, Coastal, Troy. Have the 5th week blocked off for Cross division play with the two best teams playing at a neutral site say, Atlanta. Everyone else playing a cross division rival every year unless they are number one. This would leave the schedule more open for interesting OOC games. It would be great to have ECU, Marshall, Charlotte, Boise, and SEC away game near the end of the schedule. Each one of these games would be like a bowl game. We could play two FCS teams if we wanted (at Home) JMU, Montana, NDSU.

Our Schedule may look like this.

Home - NC A&T
Away - Charlotte (all G5 games should be Home and Home)
Home - Wake Forest (All Small P5's should be Home and Home)
Away - Clemson (ONE buy game Each year)
Home - Coastal
Home - JMU (All FCS Home Games) Beating JMU will help our Strength
of Schedule over Texas State
Away - Troy
Home - Geogia Southern
Away - Georgia State
Home - Arkansas State (Not conference game just two teams decided to
play)
Away - Marshall (all G5 agreements should be Home and Home)
Home - Louisiana (lining up 1 thru 5) from other division

SunBelt Championship game - Two Highest rated teams from AP or Coaches. (I would be OK with the BCS algorithm to decide two)

We could Get 7 home games with this agreement and not hurt our Strength of schedule if we got the right teams. At least 7 every other year when the 1 thru 5 is Home. Also regional games that are interesting. JMU more interesting than Texas State. Boise State Home and Home. Marshall, FAU, Memphis, UCF, ECU, Charlotte, Wake, Vanderbilt, Maryland, Rutgers, Duke, Georgia Tech all Home and Home games. I think some of the independents would agree to play without a home and home. Liberty, NMSU, Army, UMASS.

We can still schedule SunBelt west...Just gives more flex with the schedule. It is like being Semi Independent.

I would do this with All Sports not just Football.

Why would your fantasy schedule include TWO FCS teams? Both of those are good FCS teams, but only one counts towards bowl eligibility. That would be crazy and I can't imagine folks being happy with that. Also, wouldn't having the two best cross-divisional teams playing in a mid season game just increase the chance of having teams playing twice during the year, not to mention the huge problems it would create by having a mid season "variable game" on everyone's schedule. I can't see this working at all.

I would be OK with Two FCS games as long as one is a Great FCS team. Bowl Eligibility is at 6 games, hopefully we would have room to spare. If we started struggling to make a bowl we could back off the two FCS games. I like the 7 home games and I like having more control to land P5 teams and AAC teams. If we got interesting home games and 7 home games it would be worth playing two FCS teams.

I am happy with the Sunbelt. Just thinking out loud. My number one situation is a new regional FBS league. I like the CUSA/Sunbelt shuffle. Give me Charlotte Middle Tennesee, JMU, ODU. I would like to keep the Florida Schools out. I enjoy watching all sports, and FIU and FAU are too far away. I would also like the Conference Tournament to be closer. New Orleans is an expensive trip for Basketball tournament and Baseball tournament. Call me selfish...It is all about me being able to attend App Events.

[MountaineerChemist10]

I really can't say. We were already calling for Satterfield's head after we had that terrible '13 season since we're so used to winning. Attendance began to drop in '14 & '15, but gradually rose again after we won a share for SunBelt title in '16 & '17. Then it REALLY began to rise in '18 after the Penn State game & began going sold out in '19. It's an honor to be in the Top 25! This is cool.

But what happens if we went 8-4 while in the AAC? That's great, but we won championships after championships! I'm afraid we'll drop down again, lose our winning culture & occasionally go 6-6. This is not cool.

[AppSt94]

I think you have to look at each game objectively before the season starts and build a baseline based on expectations and adjust accordingly to factors as they arise. For instance, before the season started, 8-4 seemed possible given our 4 toughest games were on the road. As the season moved on, only Troy seemed to less of a concern.

[bigdaddyg]

15. Michigan State – 91-41

14. Appalachian State – 89-38

13. Georgia – 96-39

12/11 (tie). TCU/Oklahoma State – 94-36

10. Florida State – 97-36

9. Oregon – 99-33

8. LSU – 97-32

7. Wisconsin – 102-33

6. Stanford 102-32

5. Oklahoma – 105-28

4. Clemson – 112-27

3. Boise State – 109-24

2. Ohio State – 115-19

1. Alabama – 127-13

list of the top 15 college football programs as far as winning percentage over the last 10 years. If my math is correct our record equates to just over 9 wins and just under 4 losses for the 10 year span. This list came out prior to this year so obviously it changed- updated with this season is 9.1 wins and 3.6 losses. That being said the 10 year average isn't much above 8-4. We obviously would be foolish to get used to or expect 13-1 or even 11-3 seasons every year and 8-4 really isn't awful but it would be disappointing in the Sunbelt, but...maybe not so awful with ramped up conference competition each year.