IT'S WAKE FOREST.... 2017

[proasu89]

This is great and I'm happy to see it. But I'm unsure why pro-FBSers would gloat because this is just one positive against the many negatives that have emerged from the move. I was against the move, but I admitted from the start that one good thing from the move would be the chance to play UNCC, ECU and Wake, and hopefully a regional rivalry would emerge with one or two of them.

Irregardless, IMO getting a game with Wake (as cool as that is) simply does not come close to compensating for the downsides that was predicted by people that knew the realities of a move, including increased losses, decreased interest, falling attendance, huge jump in student-athlettes missing classes, big increases in operating budget deficits, and big jumps in subsidies and student fees. Getting a team like Wake in Boone happened sooner than expected, but the many bad things also have happened sooner than expected. And they have been more severe than expected. Losses are piling up more than expected. Attendance is dropping more than expected. Operating deficit has exploded. Athletes are missing many more classes than expected. Student fees have already reached long term projections, and will blow well past the promised limit. It's bad enough that the administration has had harsh words for Cobb for severely understating the financial burden from the move, which has left a mess for them to deal with. Sure, attendance for the Wake game will be great. But clearly one game in 2017 certainly doesn't justify all these things. SO YES, I miss the good ole days, as does most alumni (as evidence by ACTUAL attendance).

And it is completely silly to suggest expanding the stadium for one game. Attendance has been dropping for us even more than the general decline across all of college football. Our attendance will not return to the peak anytime soon. Winning will help but we will never need anything close to 30k or 40k seats any time soon---numbers are simply not there, and future growth is not there. And spending money on excess capacity and superficial appearances like removing the track is completely irresponsible when the campus is in such dire straights financially. I'm all for improving and expanding if the operating revenue pays for it. Don't keep asking the students to pay for our dreams. We already had to ask them to bail out the last expansion. Need to start acting responsible. Hard to do when we are having fun with other people's money.

That would have been a good place to stop.

[EastHallApp]

It's unfortunate that people on both sides have to repeatedly rehash this same argument.

Scheduling Wake isn't going to change anyone's mind, no matter which side of the debate they were on. It is, however, a great step for the program. How about we all just recognize and celebrate that, and look forward to what should be an incredible atmosphere in KBS three years from now.

[App91]

Let's be honest that Weak is probably the lowest P5 school. They matter more to us because of the history and will help fill the stands, but BARELY a P5 program. Maybe when UNC is coming off the Death penalty they will come up from the hill

Are you seriously trying to make light of this? This is a home and home (not a 2 for one or contract that has a neutral site) versus an in state P5 program.

I challenge you to find another G5 program that was able to set up an in-state true home and home vs a P5 program their first year on transitioning.

Unbelievable.[/quot

BACK OFF!!
Not making lite of it at all, simply pointing out it is huge for us and yes a P5 school, but wake is the lowest member of the p5 schools and not big elsewhere]

[Saint3333]

Couldn't find one?

You didn't say you thought it was big for us in your post, had you led with that it would have helped.

It is the biggest home and home we've ever signed, period.

[ASU-FTW]

BACK OFF!!
Not making lite of it at all, simply pointing out it is huge for us and yes a P5 school, but wake is the lowest member of the p5 schools and not big elsewhere]

Big for us is all that matters to me at this point. Plus, a lot can change in three years.

[ASUPATCH]

I will happily take Wake, Wyoming and Southern Miss over.......Mars Hill, Lenoir Rhyne and Jacksonville.

[ASUMountaineer]

Let's be honest that Weak is probably the lowest P5 school. They matter more to us because of the history and will help fill the stands, but BARELY a P5 program. Maybe when UNC is coming off the Death penalty they will come up from the hill

Are you seriously trying to make light of this? This is a home and home (not a 2 for one or contract that has a neutral site) versus an in state P5 program.

I challenge you to find another G5 program that was able to set up an in-state true home and home vs a P5 program their first year on transitioning.

Unbelievable.[/quot

BACK OFF!!
Not making lite of it at all, simply pointing out it is huge for us and yes a P5 school, but wake is the lowest member of the p5 schools and not big elsewhere]

Interesting response. I bet Scott, the other coaches, and our players felt the same about your posts calling for people to lose their jobs.

[AppState89]

Someone place copy or capture these negative posts about us moving to FBS. Some will be eating a lot of crow in a few years. Just wait until 2017 when Wake comes to Boone and gets beat by 21pts. Go Apps!!!

Been doing this all along. Got several pages of them.

Anyone who thinks we are where we will be in a few years isn't paying attention to what is really going on in the world of college football and athletics in general. The moves are not done. The only thing that has slowed things down to a crawl this time is the pending and finished suits and all the pay to play situations floating around. Once the P5 get through the season and assess where things stand and how they affect them the next moves will take place. The bottom line is this has always been and will always be about money. The P5 want as much as they can get and the G5 schools need to figure out how best to divide the scraps. Once the P5 get their way the rest of FBS will decide how to split up what is left and what moves to make to maximize what's available. And the current FCS will be dropped ever further down with reduced scholarships down to 50 or so. As many things that have changed in the past 3 to 4 years that part has stayed the same. And most talk in the college football land still say when, not if. Stay tuned.

I see I made a typo too....Please not place...LOL...Guess I get a little excited when I get upset..

[NewApp]

This is great and I'm happy to see it. But I'm unsure why pro-FBSers would gloat because this is just one positive against the many negatives that have emerged from the move. I was against the move, but I admitted from the start that one good thing from the move would be the chance to play UNCC, ECU and Wake, and hopefully a regional rivalry would emerge with one or two of them.

Irregardless, IMO getting a game with Wake (as cool as that is) simply does not come close to compensating for the downsides that was predicted by people that knew the realities of a move, including increased losses, decreased interest, falling attendance, huge jump in student-athlettes missing classes, big increases in operating budget deficits, and big jumps in subsidies and student fees. Getting a team like Wake in Boone happened sooner than expected, but the many bad things also have happened sooner than expected. And they have been more severe than expected. Losses are piling up more than expected. Attendance is dropping more than expected. Operating deficit has exploded. Athletes are missing many more classes than expected. Student fees have already reached long term projections, and will blow well past the promised limit. It's bad enough that the administration has had harsh words for Cobb for severely understating the financial burden from the move, which has left a mess for them to deal with. Sure, attendance for the Wake game will be great. But clearly one game in 2017 certainly doesn't justify all these things. SO YES, I miss the good ole days, as does most alumni (as evidence by ACTUAL attendance).

And it is completely silly to suggest expanding the stadium for one game. Attendance has been dropping for us even more than the general decline across all of college football. Our attendance will not return to the peak anytime soon. Winning will help but we will never need anything close to 30k or 40k seats any time soon---numbers are simply not there, and future growth is not there. And spending money on excess capacity and superficial appearances like removing the track is completely irresponsible when the campus is in such dire straights financially. I'm all for improving and expanding if the operating revenue pays for it. Don't keep asking the students to pay for our dreams. We already had to ask them to bail out the last expansion. Need to start acting responsible. Hard to do when we are having fun with other people's money.

1. Student fees haven't gone up.

2. Irregardless

3. How much money each year do you send to the Rams Club?

Wrong on number one. Student fees did go up during the Facilities enhancement program.

[Saint3333]

The facilities were built in 2009, we announced the move in March 2013.

[App91]

Couldn't find one?

You didn't say you thought it was big for us in your post, had you led with that it would have helped.

It is the biggest home and home we've ever signed, period.

I agree, It will be the largest crowd in KBS ever. All i mean is that yes wake is in a P5 onference but not really a P5 team. It helps us, I love it and its causing some buzz. I am at a conf. of NC people, lots of people are talking about it.

[App91]

Let's be honest that Weak is probably the lowest P5 school. They matter more to us because of the history and will help fill the stands, but BARELY a P5 program. Maybe when UNC is coming off the Death penalty they will come up from the hill

Are you seriously trying to make light of this? This is a home and home (not a 2 for one or contract that has a neutral site) versus an in state P5 program.

I challenge you to find another G5 program that was able to set up an in-state true home and home vs a P5 program their first year on transitioning.

Unbelievable.[/quot

BACK OFF!!
Not making lite of it at all, simply pointing out it is huge for us and yes a P5 school, but wake is the lowest member of the p5 schools and not big elsewhere]

Interesting response. I bet Scott, the other coaches, and our players felt the same about your posts calling for people to lose their jobs.

I did, and I will continue to do so. I really hope that coaches are not reading a Fan board, but if they are they need to get better. They are in a results based business, all boils down to w's and l's. Tell me in Dec. how many coaches are fired and I am sure all of the ones fired would say the same thing. Get over that!

[AppSt94]

Let's be honest that Weak is probably the lowest P5 school. They matter more to us because of the history and will help fill the stands, but BARELY a P5 program. Maybe when UNC is coming off the Death penalty they will come up from the hill

Are you seriously trying to make light of this? This is a home and home (not a 2 for one or contract that has a neutral site) versus an in state P5 program.

I challenge you to find another G5 program that was able to set up an in-state true home and home vs a P5 program their first year on transitioning.
Unbelievable.[/quot

BACK OFF!!
Not making lite of it at all, simply pointing out it is huge for us and yes a P5 school, but wake is the lowest member of the p5 schools and not big elsewhere]

Interesting response. I bet Scott, the other coaches, and our players felt the same about your posts calling for people to lose their jobs.

I did, and I will continue to do so. I really hope that coaches are not reading a Fan board, but if they are they need to get better. They are in a results based business, all boils down to w's and l's. Tell me in Dec. how many coaches are fired and I am sure all of the ones fired would say the same thing. Get over that!

Yes coaching is performances based but there ARE other factors involved. Our coaches are working with a young group that will become our core in FBS. If you don't think coaching young players, lacking in college football experience isn't tough, then look at Va Tech. Their offense is positively stagnant this year. Is it because Frank Beamer can't coach? No! Their offense is loaded with underclassmen this year struggling with consistency. I am not comparing SS to Beamer just stating the coaching ability isn't always enough.

[ASUPATCH]

This is great and I'm happy to see it. But I'm unsure why pro-FBSers would gloat because this is just one positive against the many negatives that have emerged from the move. I was against the move, but I admitted from the start that one good thing from the move would be the chance to play UNCC, ECU and Wake, and hopefully a regional rivalry would emerge with one or two of them.

Irregardless, IMO getting a game with Wake (as cool as that is) simply does not come close to compensating for the downsides that was predicted by people that knew the realities of a move, including increased losses, decreased interest, falling attendance, huge jump in student-athlettes missing classes, big increases in operating budget deficits, and big jumps in subsidies and student fees. Getting a team like Wake in Boone happened sooner than expected, but the many bad things also have happened sooner than expected. And they have been more severe than expected. Losses are piling up more than expected. Attendance is dropping more than expected. Operating deficit has exploded. Athletes are missing many more classes than expected. Student fees have already reached long term projections, and will blow well past the promised limit. It's bad enough that the administration has had harsh words for Cobb for severely understating the financial burden from the move, which has left a mess for them to deal with. Sure, attendance for the Wake game will be great. But clearly one game in 2017 certainly doesn't justify all these things. SO YES, I miss the good ole days, as does most alumni (as evidence by ACTUAL attendance).

And it is completely silly to suggest expanding the stadium for one game. Attendance has been dropping for us even more than the general decline across all of college football. Our attendance will not return to the peak anytime soon. Winning will help but we will never need anything close to 30k or 40k seats any time soon---numbers are simply not there, and future growth is not there. And spending money on excess capacity and superficial appearances like removing the track is completely irresponsible when the campus is in such dire straights financially. I'm all for improving and expanding if the operating revenue pays for it. Don't keep asking the students to pay for our dreams. We already had to ask them to bail out the last expansion. Need to start acting responsible. Hard to do when we are having fun with other people's money.

1. Student fees haven't gone up.

2. Irregardless

3. How much money each year do you send to the Rams Club?

Wrong on number one. Student fees did go up during the Facilities enhancement program.

The facility enhancements were WAY before we announced FBS, which was what his entire argument was predicated upon. So in a nut shell, yes number 1 is right.

[NewApp]

This is great and I'm happy to see it. But I'm unsure why pro-FBSers would gloat because this is just one positive against the many negatives that have emerged from the move. I was against the move, but I admitted from the start that one good thing from the move would be the chance to play UNCC, ECU and Wake, and hopefully a regional rivalry would emerge with one or two of them.

Irregardless, IMO getting a game with Wake (as cool as that is) simply does not come close to compensating for the downsides that was predicted by people that knew the realities of a move, including increased losses, decreased interest, falling attendance, huge jump in student-athlettes missing classes, big increases in operating budget deficits, and big jumps in subsidies and student fees. Getting a team like Wake in Boone happened sooner than expected, but the many bad things also have happened sooner than expected. And they have been more severe than expected. Losses are piling up more than expected. Attendance is dropping more than expected. Operating deficit has exploded. Athletes are missing many more classes than expected. Student fees have already reached long term projections, and will blow well past the promised limit. It's bad enough that the administration has had harsh words for Cobb for severely understating the financial burden from the move, which has left a mess for them to deal with. Sure, attendance for the Wake game will be great. But clearly one game in 2017 certainly doesn't justify all these things. SO YES, I miss the good ole days, as does most alumni (as evidence by ACTUAL attendance).

And it is completely silly to suggest expanding the stadium for one game. Attendance has been dropping for us even more than the general decline across all of college football. Our attendance will not return to the peak anytime soon. Winning will help but we will never need anything close to 30k or 40k seats any time soon---numbers are simply not there, and future growth is not there. And spending money on excess capacity and superficial appearances like removing the track is completely irresponsible when the campus is in such dire straights financially. I'm all for improving and expanding if the operating revenue pays for it. Don't keep asking the students to pay for our dreams. We already had to ask them to bail out the last expansion. Need to start acting responsible. Hard to do when we are having fun with other people's money.

1. Student fees haven't gone up.

2. Irregardless

3. How much money each year do you send to the Rams Club?

Wrong on number one. Student fees did go up during the Facilities enhancement program.

The facility enhancements were WAY before we announced FBS, which was what his entire argument was predicated upon. So in a nut shell, yes number 1 is right.

According to the CW on this board, the enhancements were largely in prep for our going FBS>

[ASUPATCH]

This is great and I'm happy to see it. But I'm unsure why pro-FBSers would gloat because this is just one positive against the many negatives that have emerged from the move. I was against the move, but I admitted from the start that one good thing from the move would be the chance to play UNCC, ECU and Wake, and hopefully a regional rivalry would emerge with one or two of them.

Irregardless, IMO getting a game with Wake (as cool as that is) simply does not come close to compensating for the downsides that was predicted by people that knew the realities of a move, including increased losses, decreased interest, falling attendance, huge jump in student-athlettes missing classes, big increases in operating budget deficits, and big jumps in subsidies and student fees. Getting a team like Wake in Boone happened sooner than expected, but the many bad things also have happened sooner than expected. And they have been more severe than expected. Losses are piling up more than expected. Attendance is dropping more than expected. Operating deficit has exploded. Athletes are missing many more classes than expected. Student fees have already reached long term projections, and will blow well past the promised limit. It's bad enough that the administration has had harsh words for Cobb for severely understating the financial burden from the move, which has left a mess for them to deal with. Sure, attendance for the Wake game will be great. But clearly one game in 2017 certainly doesn't justify all these things. SO YES, I miss the good ole days, as does most alumni (as evidence by ACTUAL attendance).

And it is completely silly to suggest expanding the stadium for one game. Attendance has been dropping for us even more than the general decline across all of college football. Our attendance will not return to the peak anytime soon. Winning will help but we will never need anything close to 30k or 40k seats any time soon---numbers are simply not there, and future growth is not there. And spending money on excess capacity and superficial appearances like removing the track is completely irresponsible when the campus is in such dire straights financially. I'm all for improving and expanding if the operating revenue pays for it. Don't keep asking the students to pay for our dreams. We already had to ask them to bail out the last expansion. Need to start acting responsible. Hard to do when we are having fun with other people's money.

1. Student fees haven't gone up.

2. Irregardless

3. How much money each year do you send to the Rams Club?

Wrong on number one. Student fees did go up during the Facilities enhancement program.

The facility enhancements were WAY before we announced FBS, which was what his entire argument was predicated upon. So in a nut shell, yes number 1 is right.

According to the CW on this board, the enhancements were largely in prep for our going FBS>

The wheels for facility enhancement were put in place well before anyone had any inclination of FBS. That a stretch even for the Clinenator.

[ASUMountaineer]

Let's be honest that Weak is probably the lowest P5 school. They matter more to us because of the history and will help fill the stands, but BARELY a P5 program. Maybe when UNC is coming off the Death penalty they will come up from the hill

Are you seriously trying to make light of this? This is a home and home (not a 2 for one or contract that has a neutral site) versus an in state P5 program.

I challenge you to find another G5 program that was able to set up an in-state true home and home vs a P5 program their first year on transitioning.

Unbelievable.[/quot

BACK OFF!!
Not making lite of it at all, simply pointing out it is huge for us and yes a P5 school, but wake is the lowest member of the p5 schools and not big elsewhere]

Interesting response. I bet Scott, the other coaches, and our players felt the same about your posts calling for people to lose their jobs.

I did, and I will continue to do so. I really hope that coaches are not reading a Fan board, but if they are they need to get better. They are in a results based business, all boils down to w's and l's. Tell me in Dec. how many coaches are fired and I am sure all of the ones fired would say the same thing. Get over that!

19 games while transitioning to FBS.

Get over yourself.

[WVAPPeer]

Now, of course, I don't agree with my buddy 91 when it comes to the coaches, but I do understand what he is saying about WF - Yes everyone, including 91 and myself, is happy to have the home and home with WF but he is also correct that WF is at the absolute bottom of the P5 teams - THOSE ARE 2 SEPERATE ISSUES - 1. WF is coming to The Rock - GREAT!!! - 2. WF is a bad football team - WELL???

[bigdaddyg]

increased student fees? that is a ridiculous argument for the pro-FCS side. Have we seen a huge decline in the number of applicants for enrollment? For that matter is the overall enrollment suffering due to the increase in fees? very doubtful on both fronts.

decreased attendance. Also doubtful:

Campbell- 25,861
SA- 24,215
Liberty- 26,058

Average (25,378) Let's re-explore this stat once the final 3 conference games are in the books (two of which are very winnable).

Just for comparison let's look at some numbers for WFU:

Gardner Webb- 26,925
Army- 28,123
Syracuse- 25,107
BC- 26,439

Average (26,648). According to my math not a huge variance.

Southern Conference looks really appealing now (little bit of sarcasm). Who the heck is Mercer? You know things can't be going in the right direction for the SC when VMI is brought back. Some of you pro FCS guys are probably right. Maybe they should have just brought back the Carolina's Conference and we could schedule Mars Hill, Newberry and Lenoir-Rhyne.

Western Carolina 4-0 6-2
Chattanooga 4-0 5-3
Wofford 3-1 5-3
Samford 3-2 4-3
Furman 1-2 2-6
Mercer 1-4 5-4
Citadel 0-3 2-6
Virginia Military Institute 0-4 1-8

I will readily admit that the playoffs were exciting and the championships were really cool. The occasional televised games were special when we didn't know any better. I have to say that it turned bad for me when our games started being broadcast on PBS. It was really time to move.

[bcoach]

increased student fees? that is a ridiculous argument for the pro-FCS side. Have we seen a huge decline in the number of applicants for enrollment? For that matter is the overall enrollment suffering due to the increase in fees? very doubtful on both fronts.

decreased attendance. Also doubtful:

Campbell- 25,861
SA- 24,215
Liberty- 26,058

Average (25,378) Let's re-explore this stat once the final 3 conference games are in the books (two of which are very winnable).

Just for comparison let's look at some numbers for WFU:

Gardner Webb- 26,925
Army- 28,123
Syracuse- 25,107
BC- 26,439

Average (26,648). According to my math not a huge variance.

Southern Conference looks really appealing now (little bit of sarcasm). Who the heck is Mercer? You know things can't be going in the right direction for the SC when VMI is brought back. Some of you pro FCS guys are probably right. Maybe they should have just brought back the Carolina's Conference and we could schedule Mars Hill, Newberry and Lenoir-Rhyne.

Western Carolina 4-0 6-2
Chattanooga 4-0 5-3
Wofford 3-1 5-3
Samford 3-2 4-3
Furman 1-2 2-6
Mercer 1-4 5-4
Citadel 0-3 2-6
Virginia Military Institute 0-4 1-8

I will readily admit that the playoffs were exciting and the championships were really cool. The occasional televised games were special when we didn't know any better. I have to say that it turned bad for me when our games started being broadcast on PBS. It was really time to move.

TV is not a good argument. We have been on one time. The rest of the time we are on laptops just like before.