ECU hasn’t made a bowl game since App joined the FBS in 2014.

Today they surpassed 12k season tickets for 2021.

You can say quit a few negative things about that program, but they have the most dedicated fanbase in NC.

What does that say about us then

beav910 wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 02, 2021 7:18 pm

What does that say about us then

That we better keep winning or we’re in deep doodoo

That for whatever reasons we have been very bad at selling season tickets to App State football games. Could be a distance thing, a weather thing, an availability of walk up ticket thing, but whatever it is the people in charge need to figure it out and fix it.

Our fanbase just isn't as devoted as we'd like to believe.

Keep in mind that they have about 63% more living alumni than we do...I suspect it's more about the sheer numbers of supporters vs passion. Especially with the dismal way they've been performing on the field.

Another factor could be our years as 1AA. They were fun but I'd wager that ECU got the jump on us by moving to Div 1 earlier in terms of fan support. We will get there.

mike87 wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:35 am

Another factor could be our years as 1AA. They were fun but I'd wager that ECU got the jump on us by moving to Div 1 earlier in terms of fan support. We will get there.

I'd be interested to see the numbers by year. Just from memory, I remember quite a few games in '09-'10 in the 30k range. It seems our move to FBS (come on man, we can't have our own fan base saying "moving to D1" after we fought that argument so hard!!) didn't really move the needle much in terms of fan support. Sure we've had our Wake Forest and Miami games, but outside of those 2 it seems attendance and support has remained rather stagnant. Maybe season tickets and Yosef Club membership have increased, but I don't know that info.

Saint3333 wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:15 am

Our fanbase just isn't as devoted as we'd like to believe.

What investment does the Athletic Department put into it though? What do they do to get casuals interested. I harped on it in the Fall Camp thread earlier, but there’s no Spring Game and activities to go along with the game to get fans excited and intrigued for the upcoming season. ECU has the pigskin Pigout which was always awesome to go to in Greenville growing up. There’s VERY minimal outreach from the athletic department to let fans know what’s going on, nothing on appstatesports about when Fall Camp starts. Never hear anything straight from Gillin; ECU’s AD sends a “From The Helm” memo to their fans every month. ECU has a Kickoff Luncheon the last week of August, what does App do? ECU has “Free Boot Friday’s” before every home game in the fall, fans gather downtown and listen to music, there’s alcohol and food vendors all over. Again, what does App do? These are very simple things they can do to engage the fan base. I like things Gillin has done here but arguably the most important part of it IMO he has completely whiffed on. There’s no excuse for the lack of fan engagement that we have when we have won as much as we have.

ArmantiWaterSafety wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 03, 2021 11:03 am

mike87 wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:35 am

Another factor could be our years as 1AA. They were fun but I'd wager that ECU got the jump on us by moving to Div 1 earlier in terms of fan support. We will get there.

I'd be interested to see the numbers by year. Just from memory, I remember quite a few games in '09-'10 in the 30k range. It seems our move to FBS (come on man, we can't have our own fan base saying "moving to D1" after we fought that argument so hard!!) didn't really move the needle much in terms of fan support. Sure we've had our Wake Forest and Miami games, but outside of those 2 it seems attendance and support has remained rather stagnant. Maybe season tickets and Yosef Club membership have increased, but I don't know that info.

Dang, I can't believe I did that. Self imposed ban from posting for a couple days for that one. CS to BS, that's what I meant.

Saint3333 wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 02, 2021 6:42 pm

ECU hasn’t made a bowl game since App joined the FBS in 2014.

Today they surpassed 12k season tickets for 2021.

You can say quit a few negative things about that program, but they have the most dedicated fanbase in NC.

This is actually a down year for ECU season tickets, a few years ago they would hit 20k with ease.

I think ECU is starting to turn the corner though so fan support will be back once the wins come.

Rick83 wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:34 am

Keep in mind that they have about 63% more living alumni than we do...I suspect it's more about the sheer numbers of supporters vs passion. Especially with the dismal way they've been performing on the field.

https://mountaineersathleticfund.com/yo ... index.html

Using the latest membership guide:

ECU has 4000 donors for $5.2mil. They have 191,000 living alumni. 2.0% donate an average of $1300.
App has 2700 donors for $3.7mil. We have 138,000 living alumni. 1.9% donate an average of $1370.

We're actually pretty even in terms of number of percentage donating. Our alumni actually donate a little more on average. I would call us equals in terms of passion and supporters in this metric. They just have more alumni.

Based on the current goals, they want 4000 donors this year, which is 2.8% of living alumni. If our average doesn't decrease, we'd hit $5.4 mil in donations. I just don't know how close they are to achieving that goal.

-----

For comparison of the other NC Schools in the guide:

UNC has 16800 donors for $14mil. They have 330,000 living alumni. 5% donate an average of $833.
NCSt has 18000 donors for $12.2mil. They have 250,000 living alumni. 7.2% donate an average of $677.

For comparison of peer schools out of state:

ArkSt has 2000 donors for $4.3mil. They have 81,000 living alumni. 2.4% donate an average of $2150.
Wyoming has 3600 donors for $3.5mil. They have 142,000 living alumni. 2.5% donate an average of $972.

VNova wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 03, 2021 5:23 pm

Rick83 wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:34 am

Keep in mind that they have about 63% more living alumni than we do...I suspect it's more about the sheer numbers of supporters vs passion. Especially with the dismal way they've been performing on the field.

https://mountaineersathleticfund.com/yo ... index.html

Using the latest membership guide:

ECU has 4000 donors for $5.2mil. They have 191,000 living alumni. 2.0% donate an average of $1300.
App has 2700 donors for $3.7mil. We have 138,000 living alumni. 1.9% donate an average of $1370.

We're actually pretty even in terms of number of percentage donating. Our alumni actually donate a little more on average. I would call us equals in terms of passion and supporters in this metric. They just have more alumni.

Based on the current goals, they want 4000 donors this year, which is 2.8% of living alumni. If our average doesn't decrease, we'd hit $5.4 mil in donations. I just don't know how close they are to achieving that goal.

-----

For comparison of the other NC Schools in the guide:

UNC has 16800 donors for $14mil. They have 330,000 living alumni. 5% donate an average of $833.
NCSt has 18000 donors for $12.2mil. They have 250,000 living alumni. 7.2% donate an average of $677.

For comparison of peer schools out of state:

ArkSt has 2000 donors for $4.3mil. They have 81,000 living alumni. 2.4% donate an average of $2150.
Wyoming has 3600 donors for $3.5mil. They have 142,000 living alumni. 2.5% donate an average of $972.

Wow...that is some great information VNova...thanks!

App has some work to do but before we beat ourselves up TOO badly, let's remember that ECU has a few decades head start on us in terms of building infra-structure, fan base and momentum at the FBS level. I do give their fans credit for weathering the past few seasons better than most of the OTHER NC schools would have. Other than App, they are the only other true "football" school in the state and I am sure they'll get things back on track. App's location, the disbursement of our alums and the lack of high income degree programs historically have created challenges. We don't have a medical school or law school. Our College of Business is excellent, but it is a relative new comer to the party. I think we will continue to do more with less, but we do need to figure some things out in terms of fund raising and ticket sales. I wish I knew the answer.

Yosef84 wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 05, 2021 11:35 am

We don't have a medical school or law school.

And the state keeps blocking our attempts at those since majority of the Board of Governors are UNC alum. They are intentionally blocking our attempts to grow.

AppStateNews wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 05, 2021 11:38 am

Yosef84 wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 05, 2021 11:35 am

We don't have a medical school or law school.

And the state keeps blocking our attempts at those since majority of the Board of Governors are UNC alum. They are intentionally blocking our attempts to grow.

I've always wondered why we haven't been able to get more doctoral programs pushed through...

AppStateNews wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 05, 2021 11:38 am

Yosef84 wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 05, 2021 11:35 am

We don't have a medical school or law school.

And the state keeps blocking our attempts at those since majority of the Board of Governors are UNC alum. They are intentionally blocking our attempts to grow.

the UNC BOG does us no favors and they can kiss my ass. But boone is (hopefully) never going to have the infrastructure and population to support a med school. There are two things I would love to see our administration do:

1. continue to work with WFU and Baptist for BCHS. Who knows what will happen as Wake opens and expands its medical school in Charlotte. There may be opportunity to grow the college in collaboration in Winston Salem.

2. This is more ambitious, but UNCA has relative stagnant growth and isn't really providing Asheville with the services that its advanced growth really need. If I was the Chancellor I would work towards merging App with UNCA (under the App umbrella of course) and turn UNCA into the research focused grad school of Appalachian. Asheville is a logical place for a public med school, since none exists in WNC or Upstate SC (UNC and USC could partner and split funding), and as reticent as I am to provide more lawyers into this world, it could work there as well. UNC system saves in admin and funding for UNCA undergrad students, App gets to expand its research and grad/Phd programs, Asheville gets the world class university it needs to keep growing. Thats a win-win-win. Cherry on top is this would really stick a chap in the ass of our former rivals in the whee.

To buy alcohol in KBS, you have to buy a Yosef Club $25 or greater membership and then the beer is also cheaper. Or Yosef Club members get a discount on beer/food in KBS.

This is the simple truth. We don't have a wide following of fans we just have a VERY dedicated core. We travel well but it is that same core of fans every year. The casual fan is not going to donate. If we do not expand that core nothing will change.

BallantyneApp wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 05, 2021 12:08 pm

AppStateNews wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 05, 2021 11:38 am

Yosef84 wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 05, 2021 11:35 am

We don't have a medical school or law school.

And the state keeps blocking our attempts at those since majority of the Board of Governors are UNC alum. They are intentionally blocking our attempts to grow.

the UNC BOG does us no favors and they can kiss my ass. But boone is (hopefully) never going to have the infrastructure and population to support a med school.

I don't agree with this statement. Dartmouth has a medical school and Hanover is much smaller with less infrastructure than Boone. We already have an expanded nursing school and a hospital in Boone, a medical school would be an easy addition if the BOG would ever let us have one. Not sure how they continue to ignore the need of a medical school in the Western North Carolina mountains. At the least we should go for a dental school so we can help all those impoverished appalachian mountain kids with "mountain dew mouth". Since mountain dew originated in West Jefferson (I think) it would be only appropriate to put a dental school at App State to help fix all the poor teeth in the area.