Article: App State Twitter Divide

[EastHallApp]

I just caution everyone here who constantly (and I mean CONSTANTLY) makes App fandom all about who’s donating the most money to prove it. Yes, money helps. But others contribute in other ways...emotional investment (and how that investment manifests itself) is extremely important too. Writing a check doesn’t make you a better fan than anyone else. There is absolutely a toxic subculture of app fans who think that.

No but what you’re willing to give up matters. Whether that’s time traveling to games, making calls to friends to donate or go to games, or cut the check.

When I was young I gave what I could and spent more time fundraising, made a lot more events/games as well. Time is more limited now, but checks are bigger.

Watching games on TV isn’t enough to get a seat at the table, being invested does matter.

It will take a much larger percentage of our fans to make strides and be the program we all love App to be.

Will it? App State is one of the (at least) top 5 G5 over the last 10 years, they just had a wrestling All-American, and the men’s basketball team went to the Big Dance. If App can do all those things with the current money coming in, why do I have to donate as well?

Our coach salary pool is around the middle of the Sun Belt I believe and isn’t even competitive with AAC or MWC. While we were fortunate/smart with Satt and Drink (and hopefully Clark), eventually that kind of budgetary disadvantage will likely catch up to us. Not to mention, you’d like to see the program keep improving, right?

As for basketball, I’m going to push back on the notion that one hot week In Pensacola for our first tourney bid in 21 years qualifies that program as a success story.

If you don’t like the idea of contributing money so we can pay rich coaches more money, I can empathize with that. But it’s a reality of college athletics whether we like it or not.

[Saint3333]

If you make a choice not to donate that’s your personal choice.

However if you truly wish to keep quality coaches and fully fund the sports we carry you’d give what you can, whether that be time or money.

[appdaze]

Why should I just GIVE them money with nothing in return?

So that others in the future can have similar if not better experiences than you. Its called thinking beyond yourself. But if you are the only thing that matters to you then yes you should look for things that give you perks. I also give to public schools, including athletic departments that gain a nice chunk of money off their football ticket sales. Giving to App is just doing that to a larger entity. Honestly if doing something as simple as donating a few bucks to Appalachian State requires this much explanation then I don't think anything anyone says on here is going to matter.

I have also mentioned multiple times how my main issue isn't the giving but the attitude and actions of those on that twitter. For some reason, no one has an answer for why they should be proud of those things. Everyone just latched on to the one point they thought they could argue and that is the giving piece. Give or don't give. So flipping be it. Just don't act like a dick like some of those people seem to be proud of doing. That is all I ask of them.

[appdaze]

I guess when I donate to the various organizations (some private, some public) that I donate money to I don't really ask them "whats in it for me?"

I just do it to help other people. Everything in life doesn't have to be transactional. Sometimes as people we just give. These days I rarely make it to Boone, let alone a sporting event. When I give to my local public school, Appstate, the Red Cross, Habitat for Humanity, I don't ask them for anything, believe it or not I don't even write it off on my taxes. Sometimes people just want to give to future generations so that they have something better.

In the end no one is forcing anyone to give. There is nothing wrong with asking recent graduates for donations. There is something wrong with being a dick in return. That is more worrisome to me than not wanting to donate. I truly hope that isn't a reputation that Appgrads acquire.

That's good for you. Doesn't change the fact that other people feel differently, and ignoring them means missing out on potential donors.

It's probably not realistic to equate college athletics booster clubs with the other types of charities and causes you mentioned, either.

East, I never said to ignore these people. In a previous post I said that these people and YC staff should have a sit down and find some middle ground. Its realistic as both are for good causes, just different environments. One brings young men and women athletic and academic opportunities they may not have otherwise had. Others bring people food, water, shelter etc. If our athletic program had never had a booster club to gain donations what would our athletic program look like today?

[appdaze]

I just caution everyone here who constantly (and I mean CONSTANTLY) makes App fandom all about who’s donating the most money to prove it. Yes, money helps. But others contribute in other ways...emotional investment (and how that investment manifests itself) is extremely important too. Writing a check doesn’t make you a better fan than anyone else. There is absolutely a toxic subculture of app fans who think that.

No but what you’re willing to give up matters. Whether that’s time traveling to games, making calls to friends to donate or go to games, or cut the check.

When I was young I gave what I could and spent more time fundraising, made a lot more events/games as well. Time is more limited now, but checks are bigger.

Watching games on TV isn’t enough to get a seat at the table, being invested does matter.

It will take a much larger percentage of our fans to make strides and be the program we all love App to be.

Will it? App State is one of the (at least) top 5 G5 over the last 10 years, they just had a wrestling All-American, and the men’s basketball team went to the Big Dance. If App can do all those things with the current money coming in, why do I have to donate as well?

You don't have to donate. But you also shouldn't be a dick to those that ask you to. Just say no thank you and move on with life. You probably do that every single time you go to the grocery store and they ask you to donate to the charity of the day at the register and you probably say no thank you 99% of the time. Guess what? Next time you go to the store they are going to ask you again. Maybe next time you should rip in to that 16 year old kid for asking you to donate. Call them names, kick them around a little bit, and tell them to never ask you to donate again.

As I said in a previous post, there are other ways to give back besides just money. I suggest these people talk to the YC about such things and I am certain if they truly want to support the university beyond their initial time as a student without spending a dime the YC can help with that.

They did all that by paying our basketball coach one of the highest salaries we have paid. They did that by spending millions on upgrading facilities to attract higher level recruits, they did that on the marketing and exposure creating by the winning environment stemming from the FCS years and continued the momentum as we moved up. They did that with mostly quality hires across the board. This list could go on and on, but yes, people donating more money a long the way did its part to help.

Should I apply your logic to other areas of the world? If teachers can teach students and get them to pass end of the year tests with what meager supplies we give them why should we give them anything better?

[MrCraig]

I just caution everyone here who constantly (and I mean CONSTANTLY) makes App fandom all about who’s donating the most money to prove it. Yes, money helps. But others contribute in other ways...emotional investment (and how that investment manifests itself) is extremely important too. Writing a check doesn’t make you a better fan than anyone else. There is absolutely a toxic subculture of app fans who think that.

No but what you’re willing to give up matters. Whether that’s time traveling to games, making calls to friends to donate or go to games, or cut the check.

When I was young I gave what I could and spent more time fundraising, made a lot more events/games as well. Time is more limited now, but checks are bigger.

Watching games on TV isn’t enough to get a seat at the table, being invested does matter.

It will take a much larger percentage of our fans to make strides and be the program we all love App to be.

Will it? App State is one of the (at least) top 5 G5 over the last 10 years, they just had a wrestling All-American, and the men’s basketball team went to the Big Dance. If App can do all those things with the current money coming in, why do I have to donate as well?

You don't have to donate. But you also shouldn't be a dick to those that ask you to. Just say no thank you and move on with life. You probably do that every single time you go to the grocery store and they ask you to donate to the charity of the day at the register and you probably say no thank you 99% of the time. Guess what? Next time you go to the store they are going to ask you again. Maybe next time you should rip in to that 16 year old kid for asking you to donate. Call them names, kick them around a little bit, and tell them to never ask you to donate again.

As I said in a previous post, there are other ways to give back besides just money. I suggest these people talk to the YC about such things and I am certain if they truly want to support the university beyond their initial time as a student without spending a dime the YC can help with that.

They did all that by paying our basketball coach one of the highest salaries we have paid. They did that by spending millions on upgrading facilities to attract higher level recruits, they did that on the marketing and exposure creating by the winning environment stemming from the FCS years and continued the momentum as we moved up. They did that with mostly quality hires across the board. This list could go on and on, but yes, people donating more money a long the way did its part to help.

Should I apply your logic to other areas of the world? If teachers can teach students and get them to pass end of the year tests with what meager supplies we give them why should we give them anything better?

This is conflating giving money to charity and giving money to a for-profit enterprise. When I go to the store, they ask if I would like to donate to the children's hospital or whatever. They don't ask me to donate money to the store that I just shopped in so they can upgrade facilities or pay managers more.

Again, I'm not saying no one should donate to YC. I do, and we need people to continue that. My point is, if we want more people to donate to YC, there has got to be better messaging. If a former student and casual fan attends a game, sees the new endzone seating, and watches App win bowl games, how do you convince them that the athletic department needs MORE money? Easthall App and Bootsy seem to have gotten my point.

Btw, it's funny you should bring up the teacher analogy, because that's exactly what many people (especially state legislatures) think.

[EastHallApp]

I will say this for appdaze's point, I think not being a jerk to people is a good rule of thumb in all contexts, but one that people seem to forget a lot more often when they're at their keyboard.

[Rekdiver]

I did not read thru the string....i give because we need it and if any grad thinks we have enough then we did a poor job of educating them.

[goapps93]

I guess when I donate to the various organizations (some private, some public) that I donate money to I don't really ask them "whats in it for me?"

I just do it to help other people. Everything in life doesn't have to be transactional. Sometimes as people we just give. These days I rarely make it to Boone, let alone a sporting event. When I give to my local public school, Appstate, the Red Cross, Habitat for Humanity, I don't ask them for anything, believe it or not I don't even write it off on my taxes. Sometimes people just want to give to future generations so that they have something better.

In the end no one is forcing anyone to give. There is nothing wrong with asking recent graduates for donations. There is something wrong with being a dick in return. That is more worrisome to me than not wanting to donate. I truly hope that isn't a reputation that Appgrads acquire.

But the Yosef Club and the Appalachian State athletic department isn't a charity. They may be "non-profit," but they provide a product and recieve payment for it in return (and don't pay the people who actually provide the product, but that's another discussion). App athletics makes money off of tickets, merchandise, concessions, etc. Why should I just GIVE them money with nothing in return?

It's a fair question. What do I get to motivates me to contribute to the Yosef Club?

Sept 1998 - As a high school senior, in the stands for my first game at KBS. I remember looking out over the mountains and watching the Mountaineers crush VMI. And that was the day I fell in love with ASU.

Sept 2007 - Celebrating like crazy as I listened to David Jackson and Steve Brown tell me my alma mater shocked the world, beating Michigan at the Big House.

2005-2007 - Living the dream as I watched my alma mater win three national championships in a row.

2014 - Watching my alma mater lose a heartbreaker to Liberty on Homecoming, then turn the corner and begin the amazing winning FBS streak we're currently riding.

And then there's The Miracle on the Mountain, epic rivalries against Marshall and GASO, Reaves, Satterfield, Coakley, Armanti, Quick, ADG, Duck, Zac, #5, the bowl game streak...I could go on and on, folks. But I could never place a value on all of the happy memories I have related to App State football. Priceless.

I also paid for my own tuition, so I get it. But App State football adds so much joy to my life. I care about the athletes, I care about the program and the program needs help to remain competitive. And that's why I donate to the Yosef Club.

This is the best answer I’ve seen for “why should I donate to YC?”
Maybe creating some promos with this kind of stuff will get more people to donate.
You show me App beating UNC and say “your donation to Yosef Club helped make this happen” and I’m more inclined to donate. That’s certainly more convincing than “we need you to donate so we can pay a coach who already makes 3 times what you make even more, so we can hopefully keep winning. Oh and here’s a parking pass.”

McCraig,
I think you would be a great Yosef member and also an asset to the Yosef Board. If more young App grads like you would put their passion to work for the Athletic Program and the University our alma mater would be better off.

[Bootsy]

And allow me to give some props where they're due...the new Mountaineer Athletic Fund website looks fantastic and is easy to navigate. And if you haven't seen the new MAF Membership Guide, give it a look:

https://mountaineersathleticfund.com/membership-guide/

The new Guide does a great job illustrating how App Athletics compares financially to other North Carolina and Sun Belt programs. Frankly, some of this information needs to be communicated to the wider fanbase. The average fan may see App's continual success on the field and be shocked at the magic Gillin and his staff work each year on a shoestring budget to make ends meet.

[hapapp]

We also focus on football and basketball at the expense of the other programs including those we cut. If you care about all our athletes and their programs then giving to YC helps those programs perhaps even more by allowing those programs to meet NCAA scholarship levels. Quite frankly in most Olympic sports we lay behind our peers.