NEW UNIFORMS!!!

[skjellyfetti]

Just playing devil's advocate a bit here but couldn't it be argued that changing and evolving is just as much a part of Appalachian's football history as any one logo?

I'm struck by the number of gold helmets in that picture compared to the black ones.

I'm struck by the number of times we changed helmets during the gold helmet period.

We have a long history of change in our uniforms. Updating our uniforms is maintaining that proud tradition.

[ASUMountaineer]

Old southern men afraid of change blah blah blah

The world moves forward.

Young know it all with no respect for tradition or history. yada yada yada

Boy, you need to have better insight before you start shooting off your mouth. Some of those "Old Southern Men" have been at the forefront of change at ASU years before you were born.

So, you agree that our yellar version of gold is now "tradition?" It's older than the current white block A.

Nope! Old gold was ASU's color from the 20's until 1983. Yellar has about 30 more years to go until it catches up.

BTW, if they ever decided to go back to old gold, I'd be fine with it though I do like the yellow too. My favorite helmet is the snow-capped A on old gold that I believe was only used in 1982...maybe the old heads can verify that.

[ASUMountaineer]

Just playing devil's advocate a bit here but couldn't it be argued that changing and evolving is just as much a part of Appalachian's football history as any one logo?

I'm struck by the number of gold helmets in that picture compared to the black ones.

I'm struck by the number of times we changed helmets during the gold helmet period.

We have a long history of change in our uniforms. Updating our uniforms is maintaining that proud tradition.

That's a good, and funny point.

We don't really compare to Michigan, Nebraska, Alabama, etc. because we've never had a particular uniform design for a very long amount of time. We have seen quick changes, like the snow-capped A and relatively steady periods, but nothing for several decades that I've seen--save for the colors.

[asumike83]

asumike83--looks like its time for a new painting--nice "DUCK" dog, time for both coming soon (duck and FB season)

That painting was by Mike Helsabeck, I'd love to see him do another with the new helmets!

Thanks, he is a great dog - black lab/German shepherd mix. Perfect duck dog too, great retriever and swims like a fish!

[Kgfish]

Old southern men afraid of change blah blah blah

The world moves forward.

Young know it all with no respect for tradition or history. yada yada yada

Boy, you need to have better insight before you start shooting off your mouth. Some of those "Old Southern Men" have been at the forefront of change at ASU years before you were born.

So, you agree that our yellar version of gold is now "tradition?" It's older than the current white block A.

Nope! Old gold was ASU's color from the 20's until 1983. Yellar has about 30 more years to go until it catches up.

BTW, if they ever decided to go back to old gold, I'd be fine with it though I do like the yellow too. My favorite helmet is the snow-capped A on old gold that I believe was only used in 1982...maybe the old heads can verify that.

The school wanted a break from Jim Brakefield's era but was told to use gold helmets so he went with the Notre Dame golden dome look. He used the snow capped A his last season in '82.

Here is another one classic Appalachian screw up stories. When Jim Brakefield was forced to retire in 1979 Fisher DeBerry wanted the job. He was told by AD Jim Jones the school was going in a different direction. Fisher heads off to be the OC at Air Force and ASU hires a young untested QB coach from Wake Forest. Three years later Maniac Mike Working is fired, never to be heard from again and 30 years later Coach DeBerry is inducted into the College Football Hall of Fame as a coach. Great job Jim!

[Kgfish]

Just playing devil's advocate a bit here but couldn't it be argued that changing and evolving is just as much a part of Appalachian's football history as any one logo?

I'm struck by the number of gold helmets in that picture compared to the black ones.

I'm struck by the number of times we changed helmets during the gold helmet period.

We have a long history of change in our uniforms. Updating our uniforms is maintaining that proud tradition.

That's a good, and funny point.

We don't really compare to Michigan, Nebraska, Alabama, etc. because we've never had a particular uniform design for a very long amount of time. We have seen quick changes, like the snow-capped A and relatively steady periods, but nothing for several decades that I've seen--save for the colors.

The problem is the university has not established a uniform (no pun intended) look or style and allows each new coach to basically do what they want. IMO, it makes marketing sense to create a standardize look to the uniforms with approved logos across the board and have each design submitted to a review board. This establishes the ASU brand and binds all teams to one another. When our athletes get off the bus there would be no mistaking where they are from.

[ASUMountaineer]

The school wanted a break from Jim Brakefield's era but was told to use gold helmets so he went with the Notre Dame golden dome look. He used the snow capped A his last season in '82.

Here is another one classic Appalachian screw up stories. When Jim Brakefield was forced to retire in 1979 Fisher DeBerry wanted the job. He was told by AD Jim Jones the school was going in a different direction. Fisher heads off to be the OC at Air Force and ASU hires a young untested QB coach from Wake Forest. Three years later Maniac Mike Working is fired, never to be heard from again and 30 years later Coach DeBerry is inducted into the College Football Hall of Fame as a coach. Great job Jim!

Thanks for sharing the history, for some of us not-so-young alums it is good to hear these things...while we know a lot about the history, we don't know all of the details.

It is amazing how one decision could have such a big effect in people's lives. It could have been the best thing to ever happen to DeBerry.

[ASUMountaineer]

Just playing devil's advocate a bit here but couldn't it be argued that changing and evolving is just as much a part of Appalachian's football history as any one logo?

I'm struck by the number of gold helmets in that picture compared to the black ones.

I'm struck by the number of times we changed helmets during the gold helmet period.

We have a long history of change in our uniforms. Updating our uniforms is maintaining that proud tradition.

That's a good, and funny point.

We don't really compare to Michigan, Nebraska, Alabama, etc. because we've never had a particular uniform design for a very long amount of time. We have seen quick changes, like the snow-capped A and relatively steady periods, but nothing for several decades that I've seen--save for the colors.

The problem is the university has not established a uniform (no pun intended) look or style and allows each new coach to basically do what they want. IMO, it makes marketing sense to create a standardize look to the uniforms with approved logos across the board and have each design submitted to a review board. This establishes the ASU brand and binds all teams to one another. When our athletes get off the bus there would be no mistaking where they are from.

I agree, especially if the schools does want to set a uniform look or style. It appears that throughout App State's history that has not been the goal. I don't disagree with you that it could/would be beneficial for App State to go this route, but of course it would probably have to begin once these new unis run their course.

[JCline0429]

Kngfish, Working was too young and inexperienced for the job for sure. However he did go 6-4-1 his first year and beat Marshall by 17, James Madison, WCU, Citadel, and ETSU. They lost to Wake by 12 and to NC State by only 3 points. Fisher did a great job at the Air Force Academy running the Y.

[Kgfish]

Kngfish, Working was too young an inexperienced for the job for sure. However he did go 6-4-1 his first year and beat Marshall by 17, James Madison, WCU, Citadel, and ETSU. The lost to Wake by 12 and to NC State by only 3 points. One of the reasons Fisher Deberry did not get the job was that they wanted to run something other than the Wish Bone.
Fisher did a great job at the Air Force Academy running the Y.

I love it when non football people make these types of decisions. It really "worked" out for App didn't it?

Wouldn't give too much credence to those JMU and Marshall W's. The 2 wins over JMU came during their first 2 years in D-I, we lost to them in their 3rd year. Marshall was 0-26-1 in the SoCon from 1977 to Nov 7 1981 when they beat us for their first ever SoCon win.

Those of us know Mike's troubles off the field and his arrogance are what got him fired. He truly didn't play well with others.

[AppinVA]

Kngfish, Working was too young an inexperienced for the job for sure. However he did go 6-4-1 his first year and beat Marshall by 17, James Madison, WCU, Citadel, and ETSU. The lost to Wake by 12 and to NC State by only 3 points. One of the reasons Fisher Deberry did not get the job was that they wanted to run something other than the Wish Bone.
Fisher did a great job at the Air Force Academy running the Y.

I love it when non football people make these types of decisions. It really "worked" out for App didn't it?

Wouldn't give too much credence to those JMU and Marshall W's. The 2 wins over JMU came during their first 2 years in D-I, we lost to them in their 3rd year. Marshall was 0-26-1 in the SoCon from 1977 to Nov 7 1981 when they beat us for their first ever SoCon win.

Those of us know Mike's troubles off the field and his arrogance are what got him fired. He truly didn't play well with others.

Be careful when typing forbidden names on the board...Somewhere in the school board office in K-town, an Appalachian alumnus is convulsing and doesn't know why.

[asutrnr81]

Kngfish, Working was too young an inexperienced for the job for sure. However he did go 6-4-1 his first year and beat Marshall by 17, James Madison, WCU, Citadel, and ETSU. The lost to Wake by 12 and to NC State by only 3 points. One of the reasons Fisher Deberry did not get the job was that they wanted to run something other than the Wish Bone.
Fisher did a great job at the Air Force Academy running the Y.

I love it when non football people make these types of decisions. It really "worked" out for App didn't it?

Wouldn't give too much credence to those JMU and Marshall W's. The 2 wins over JMU came during their first 2 years in D-I, we lost to them in their 3rd year. Marshall was 0-26-1 in the SoCon from 1977 to Nov 7 1981 when they beat us for their first ever SoCon win.

Those of us know Mike's troubles off the field and his arrogance are what got him fired. He truly didn't play well with others.

Be careful when typing forbidden names on the board...Somewhere in the school board office in K-town, an Appalachian alumnus is convulsing and doesn't know why.

Thanks man! I was just about to throw up and then I got the support I needed.....It is a good thing Scatman has not read this far....but then it would be the longest book anyone in S.C. has read in years......for he would have pitched a fit!

[asutrnr81]

I don't really see this as a big deal. The Block A is our prominent logo, and that hasn't changed at all. I have a shirt with a white Block A, I have one with a gray Block A, and I have one with a yaller block A. The common thing is that it's the Appalachian Block A. I think this fuss is much ado about nothing, but that's just my opinion.

'89 I am with you 100%. And I might add....these people complaining might want to just visit the book store who sell licensed merchandise. There are Green, Pink, Red, Blue and God forbid even Purple "A's" all over.....but they one thing in common.....They are BLOCK "A's".

[JCline0429]

I don't really see this as a big deal. The Block A is our prominent logo, and that hasn't changed at all. I have a shirt with a white Block A, I have one with a gray Block A, and I have one with a yaller block A. The common thing is that it's the Appalachian Block A. I think this fuss is much ado about nothing, but that's just my opinion.

'89 I am with you 100%. And I might add....these people complaining might want to just visit the book store who sell licensed merchandise. There are Green, Pink, Red, Blue and God forbid even Purple "A's" all over.....but they one thing in common.....They are BLOCK "A's".

I bought my daughter one of the pink t-shirts as she likes pink.

[JTApps1]

Just playing devil's advocate a bit here but couldn't it be argued that changing and evolving is just as much a part of Appalachian's football history as any one logo?

I'm struck by the number of gold helmets in that picture compared to the black ones.

I'm struck by the number of times we changed helmets during the gold helmet period.

We have a long history of change in our uniforms. Updating our uniforms is maintaining that proud tradition.

That's a good, and funny point.

We don't really compare to Michigan, Nebraska, Alabama, etc. because we've never had a particular uniform design for a very long amount of time. We have seen quick changes, like the snow-capped A and relatively steady periods, but nothing for several decades that I've seen--save for the colors.

I get what your saying about us not having as much tradition as the schools you mentioned, and we never will if we continue to change. The white A on the side of the helmet has been around for nearly 25 years so if we were ever going to establish that long lasting tradition this would be an ideal time to do it. The black A as a secondary logo is fine with me, but we should stick with the white A as our main logo on the helmet. The good thing about the white A is that it stands the test of time and isnt trendy so it makes for a great logo to stick with. At some point in time those schools above had to make a decision not to change also.

[ASUMountaineer]

Just playing devil's advocate a bit here but couldn't it be argued that changing and evolving is just as much a part of Appalachian's football history as any one logo?

I'm struck by the number of gold helmets in that picture compared to the black ones.

I'm struck by the number of times we changed helmets during the gold helmet period.

We have a long history of change in our uniforms. Updating our uniforms is maintaining that proud tradition.

That's a good, and funny point.

We don't really compare to Michigan, Nebraska, Alabama, etc. because we've never had a particular uniform design for a very long amount of time. We have seen quick changes, like the snow-capped A and relatively steady periods, but nothing for several decades that I've seen--save for the colors.

I get what your saying about us not having as much tradition as the schools you mentioned, and we never will if we continue to change. The white A on the side of the helmet has been around for nearly 25 years so if we were ever going to establish that long lasting tradition this would be an ideal time to do it. The black A as a secondary logo is fine with me, but we should stick with the white A as our main logo on the helmet. The good thing about the white A is that it stands the test of time and isnt trendy so it makes for a great logo to stick with. At some point in time those schools above had to make a decision not to change also.

So, you agree that the yellow color is more a tradition than the white block A--it's been around nearly 30 years.

If you want us to stick with something, I'm fine with that. When it comes to logos we never have, so that would be a big change. Like I said, I'm on board with that, but I never expected such an emotional outburst over the logo...of course, that was probably my first mistake.

[JTApps1]

So you agree that the yellow color is more a tradition than the white block A--it's been around nearly 30 years.

If you want us to stick with something, I'm fine with that. When it comes to logos we never have, so that would be a big change. Like I said, I'm on board with that, but I never expected such an emotional outburst over the logo...of course, that was probably my first mistake.

I wasn't debating colors so you'll have to take that up with someone else.As for emotional responses, its because for once in our history we had a common look for a long period and we had a lot of success in that period. Like I said if we ever want to create that sort of tradition this is the look to stick with.

[Kgfish]

I hear ya. I think the flying Yosef head is a much bigger faux pas than the black block A.

I just find it funny that some are griping about tradition being thrown to the side because of the black block A, but have no problem wanting to get rid of yellow as our gold--which has actually been around longer than the white block A.

The Block A was an addition to our logos the newer gold replaced old gold. Big difference. The gold being used today is much lighter than what was being used in the 80's.

For the record I do like the A on the front of the helmet but wish it wasn't that outlined thing.

So, which is it? You took issue with using the black block A because we were messing with the tradition of the white block A, as well as poor marketing. Now, you admit that the white block A was simply an addition to our logos (did you feel so emotional about the addition of the white block A to our helmets), so why can't the black block A simply be an addition without it messing with tradition?

I get why you say there's a big difference, but the underlying point remains. The white block A began its "tradition" in 1989. The yellow as gold began its tradition in 1983 which you say is not tradition. The way I see it is either both the white block A and the yellow as gold are tradition or neither is tradition.

With all of that said, the change has been made so we're really just wasting key strokes. I just think some people are getting all riled up needlessly. I don't see us messing with "tradition" in the least, and certainly don't see the black block A becoming our permanent logo. It seems to me to be much ado about nothing.

I suppose you can look at it whichever way you want. Agree we have no say in the matter but what the heck are we supposed to talk about this time of year?

The Block A didn't replace the "vintage" Yosef. That had taken place 7 years earlier when the politically correct crowd wanted to cast off the hillbilly image. They adopted a character being sold by a Boone company named AusBen manufacturing. They later removed his pipe and all references to the moonshine jug. When JM unveiled the Block A most alumni, still mad over the loss of our beloved Yosef, welcomed it as a replacement for the goofy looking design of the sanitized Yosef.

On the opposite end the outlined A has now replaced an iconic helmet design established over 25 years. It is an instantly recognizable logo and forever linked to the most stunning victory in college football history. That A was plastered on virtually every news paper, TV station and web site in the country. I honestly would not want to see it ever replaced on a black helmet. A gold helmet is a different story!

Athletic gold, which has since turned into yellow, was a replacement to real gold for what I'm told were some unusual circumstances. I guess you can look at it as tradition, but the old gold has a bunch more years of history associated with ASU than yellow. I've never heard D Jackson say Touchdown Black & Yellow!

[ASUMountaineer]

So you agree that the yellow color is more a tradition than the white block A--it's been around nearly 30 years.

If you want us to stick with something, I'm fine with that. When it comes to logos we never have, so that would be a big change. Like I said, I'm on board with that, but I never expected such an emotional outburst over the logo...of course, that was probably my first mistake.

I wasn't debating colors so you'll have to take that up with someone else.As for emotional responses, its because for once in our history we had a common look for a long period and we had a lot of success in that period. Like I said if we ever want to create that sort of tradition this is the look to stick with.

I was more-or-less asking about the colors.

As for sticking with the look--I assume you're referring to the white block A and not the circa 2000 Miami unis--then, I concur. However, we've never stuck with a logo and it doesn't appear that the admin is concerned with doing so now. Although, I would point out that the logo hasn't changed, only the colors have been reversed. It doesn't bother me, but I'm clearly in the minority.

[ASUMountaineer]

I hear ya. I think the flying Yosef head is a much bigger faux pas than the black block A.

I just find it funny that some are griping about tradition being thrown to the side because of the black block A, but have no problem wanting to get rid of yellow as our gold--which has actually been around longer than the white block A.

The Block A was an addition to our logos the newer gold replaced old gold. Big difference. The gold being used today is much lighter than what was being used in the 80's.

For the record I do like the A on the front of the helmet but wish it wasn't that outlined thing.

So, which is it? You took issue with using the black block A because we were messing with the tradition of the white block A, as well as poor marketing. Now, you admit that the white block A was simply an addition to our logos (did you feel so emotional about the addition of the white block A to our helmets), so why can't the black block A simply be an addition without it messing with tradition?

I get why you say there's a big difference, but the underlying point remains. The white block A began its "tradition" in 1989. The yellow as gold began its tradition in 1983 which you say is not tradition. The way I see it is either both the white block A and the yellow as gold are tradition or neither is tradition.

With all of that said, the change has been made so we're really just wasting key strokes. I just think some people are getting all riled up needlessly. I don't see us messing with "tradition" in the least, and certainly don't see the black block A becoming our permanent logo. It seems to me to be much ado about nothing.

I suppose you can look at it whichever way you want. Agree we have no say in the matter but what the heck are we supposed to talk about this time of year? True statement.

The Block A didn't replace the "vintage" Yosef. That had taken place 7 years earlier when the politically correct crowd wanted to cast off the hillbilly image. They adopted a character being sold by a Boone company named AusBen manufacturing. They later removed his pipe and all references to the moonshine jug. When JM unveiled the Block A most alumni, still mad over the loss of our beloved Yosef, welcomed it as a replacement for the goofy looking design of the sanitized Yosef. It replaced a logo that you didn't like, so you were ok with it. This time, you did like the logo and you're not ok with it. I get that, I really do. I wouldn't say I'm happy about it, I just like the black block A and don't really take issue with change.

On the opposite end the outlined A has now replaced an iconic helmet design established over 25 years. It is an instantly recognizable logo and forever linked to the most stunning victory in college football history. That A was plastered on virtually every news paper, TV station and web site in the country. I honestly would not want to see it ever replaced on a black helmet. A gold helmet is a different story! I get this, truly...and don't dispute it.

Athletic gold, which has since turned into yellow, was a replacement to real gold for what I'm told were some unusual circumstances. I guess you can look at it as tradition, but the old gold has a bunch more years of history associated with ASU than yellow. I've never heard D Jackson say Touchdown Black & Yellow! I also get that the old gold has more years, but the yellow has more years than the white block A...that was my only point. We're picking which traditions we like and calling it tradition, and the ones we don't refusing to accept the tradition. There's nothing wrong with that, I was just pointing it out.

I don't dispute any of your points. I would say that the black block A has simply had the colors reversed, not removed: the white background and black font has now become a black background with white font.

I also wouldn't say the logo has been replaced, it's still a block A. If it were replaced, then I would imagine the logo at midfield, midcourt, and on the sides of the AAC would be replaced. I know it's just semantics, and I also am aware that I'm a "rah rah" fan.

With that said, perhaps I'm missing something because the black block A doesn't bother me in the least...I think it looks great. I'm also just an almost 32-year old youngin that likes change!

Truthfully, I like the white block A better, but I do really like the black block A on these helmets. Good Lord, I just typed a lot. My bad!