Urban Meyer says 8 team playoff won't work

[APPARJ]

The G5 voluntarily splitting off and holding their own playoff is a terrible idea. That would basically be a repeat of the D1-A/AA split and we all know how that played out. That would be the shortest path to irrelevancy the G5 could ever take.

The best thing for the G5 future is for CFP to expand to 8 and guarantee one spot for the best G5 team.

Amen. I don't believe we fought to get to where we are, just to willingly go back to where we were. We may end up there, but I want to fight it every step of the way --not lead the parade.

We should have a sticky thread that details why App State moved so we can stop having these conversations.

The App State brand went from being a solid FCS/SoCon program in 2004 and evolved into something greater by the end of the Armanti era. It was clear that our status, brand equity and football program had outgrown where we started but didn't have a perfect place to land (still don't, IMO).

We don't (and will never) belong in the ACC, SEC or any P5 program but a case could be made as early as 2008 that we were CUSA/Sun Belt/MAC material (in football, anyway).

That said, while App State was evolving, so was the rest of college football. P5 schools got more exposure and power to the point a clear distinction between G5 and P5 was made... NEVERTHELESS, G5 schools were still "technically" still lumped in with the P5 schools.

As the SEC whispered about wanting to make its own rules and the BIG 10 muttered about not wanting to mess around with FCS schools anymore, it became more clear that eventually the conferences of the programs that made the real money (20 or 30 programs in the P5) would one day be pushed to the limit and leave the rest of college football out to dry.

In other words, the P5 would either push the NCAA to allow it to do what it wants or they would simply leave the NCAA and take their money with them. When "that" happened, the G5 would need to decide how to proceed or hope and pray the P5 schools be merciful... but a G5 "downgrade" was and is inevitable.

So App State was faced with a decision... Stay FCS, continue to compete in the playoffs in a really cool and traditional Southern Conference with a solid fan base and up and down years as time goes on (admittedly not a bad option). The downside being that the FCS would soon be relegated to D2 status when the next seismic shift occured. Or attempt to maintain football excellence and move up to an entirely different level of competition with better athletes, better coaches, better opponents and a bigger payoff potential (another pretty cool option). The downside being a smaller fish in a bigger, more competitive pond, a whacky regional conference setup that makes it much harder to travel to away games and... no playoffs (yet )

App State moved in order to claim their spot among the G5 schools. That will not change. No matter what the P5 does, we will never be a SoCon/FCS level program again.

We did not move to compete with for a P5 title with the Alabamas, Virginia Techs and Georgias of the world. It was never part of the plan. It will never be part of any plan.

We are where we're supposed to be and I'll be that in the next 5 years or so we'll be in a better geographical conference setup.

[AppinVA]

I am not in the mood for a debate tonight.

All I'll say is many of the same promises that were made...and then broken back in 1980, will be made...and then broken again.

[APPARJ]

I am not in the mood for a debate tonight.

All I'll say is many of the same promises that were made...and then broken back in 1980, will be made...and then broken again.

Sorry if my post came off as combative.

I'm not sure what promises you're referring to but I think this is a pretty clear cut case.

[JTApps1]

Herbstreet is that you?

Herbstreit* and if you're objective, you'll know I'm absolutely right.

No, Boise St. a few years ago and Utah before they joined the PAC 12 are prime examples.

Every one at the FBS level should have a shot to make the playoffs at the beginning of the year. Giving the G5 ONE spot does that. That is the right thing to do.

Would you have rather seen Miss St./Alabama rematch or perhaps Arizona/Alabama or Alabama/Boise St. People like to see David vs. Goliath and pull for the underdog in playoffs. It makes the first weekend of NCAAB.

I think Boise St. gives Alabama a competitive game this year.

There are between 30 and 40 programs that over the course of 10 years have a legitimate shot at competing for a title at least once.

The "right thing to do" is have the G5 split off into it's own league/entity.

No one playing a Sun Belt, AAC, CUSA schedule deserves a shot at a championship while there are schools playing at a significantly higher level of competition within their own conference.

Boise is an example folks use to justify their G5 auto-bid position but they're an anomaly.

Hence - the G5 should get out of a game that is set up for them to lose.

I totally agree with the Boise comment. Complete anomaly. What have they done the past several years? Back to reality and 10-2 seasons which won't get it with their confernce affiliation. Not bad, but not nearly good enough. I honestly think the 30-40 numbers is still too high. I would estimate the "legit" number is closer to 20.

ACC- Clemson, FSU and maybe VT
SEC- Alabama, LSU, Auburn, Georgia (stretch)
Big 10- Ohio State, Michigan (past 10 years and future with Harbaugh).
Pac 12- Oregon, USC (they will be back)
Big 12- Baylor, TCU, Oklahoma and Texas (consider past 10 years)

Open to suggestions for other "legit" teams.

So Boise going 10-2 then beating Arizona in the Fiesta Bowl is now considered just a "not bad" season? Wow...

[Cincy App]

So Boise going 10-2 then beating Arizona in the Fiesta Bowl is now considered just a "not bad" season? Wow...

Much talk about Boise St - deservedly so. Let's also remember that TCU was not in a power conference until 2012. Much can change in a few years. It would be wrong to completely exclude the G5 schools in an 8 or 16 team playoff.

[APPARJ]

Let's also remember that TCU was not in a power conference until 2012. Much can change in a few years.

TCU is in the heart of Ft Worth (7 million in the metro region) and has an endowment fund in excess of $1 billion (with a B) dollars.

It would be wrong to completely exclude the G5 schools in an 8 or 16 team playoff.

Based on what?

[Saint3333]

I am not in the mood for a debate tonight.

All I'll say is many of the same promises that were made...and then broken back in 1980, will be made...and then broken again.

Sorry if my post came off as combative.

I'm not sure what promises you're referring to but I think this is a pretty clear cut case.

I assume you're a younger fan if you don't remember or heard of the promises when 1-AA was created. They promised national TV exposure which eroded quickly after a season or two.

VA is right if it happens it will be the same song and dance.

[APPARJ]

I am not in the mood for a debate tonight.

All I'll say is many of the same promises that were made...and then broken back in 1980, will be made...and then broken again.

Sorry if my post came off as combative.

I'm not sure what promises you're referring to but I think this is a pretty clear cut case.

I assume you're a younger fan if you don't remember or heard of the promises when 1-AA was created. They promised national TV exposure which eroded quickly after a season or two.

VA is right if it happens it will be the same song and dance.

Sorry but I'm wondering why the topic of promises came up. The facts are that we're playing more competitive schedules, it's never been easier to watch every game (Thanks, ESPN3), we're recruiting better players and we're getting paid more than double to play P5 schools than before.

We're in a very good position to go to a Bowl next season. Are we waiting on a different promise to be fulfilled? That's a serious question.

[Saint3333]

VA is speaking to the likely promises that would be made to the G5 under a proposed split down the line. The last time a split occurred those promises were broken.

[newtoasu]

Let's also remember that TCU was not in a power conference until 2012. Much can change in a few years.

TCU is in the heart of Ft Worth (7 million in the metro region) and has an endowment fund in excess of $1 billion (with a B) dollars.

It would be wrong to completely exclude the G5 schools in an 8 or 16 team playoff.

Based on what?

SMU is in the heart of Dallas, has the same endowment as TCU and has just as long a history of football prowess as TCU. As a matter of fact, up until 3 years ago SMU and TCU were pretty much the same. So are you saying that TCU is somehow more entitled to be included and SMU forever excluded from these conversations?

Another example is Rice, which has 4 times the endowment of either TCU and SMU and again, like SMU a similar past with TCU until 3 years ago.

Thinsg achange over time. 15 years ago Oregon, TCU and Baylor were nothing. Heck the only reason that Baylor got into the Big 12 back in 1996 was then Governor Ann Richards was an alumni and agreed to not make a stick about UT, aTm, and TT going if they included Baylor.

By closing off the playoffs you preclude the chance of any team ever working their way towards the top. Nobody is saying it is easy to g=move up in national relevance but it is possible and has been done.

[APPARJ]

Let's also remember that TCU was not in a power conference until 2012. Much can change in a few years.

TCU is in the heart of Ft Worth (7 million in the metro region) and has an endowment fund in excess of $1 billion (with a B) dollars.

It would be wrong to completely exclude the G5 schools in an 8 or 16 team playoff.

Based on what?

So are you saying that TCU is somehow more entitled to be included and SMU forever excluded from these conversations?

No.

[APPARJ]

Let's also remember that TCU was not in a power conference until 2012. Much can change in a few years.

TCU is in the heart of Ft Worth (7 million in the metro region) and has an endowment fund in excess of $1 billion (with a B) dollars.

It would be wrong to completely exclude the G5 schools in an 8 or 16 team playoff.

Based on what?

SMU is in the heart of Dallas, has the same endowment as TCU and has just as long a history of football prowess as TCU. As a matter of fact, up until 3 years ago SMU and TCU were pretty much the same. So are you saying that TCU is somehow more entitled to be included and SMU forever excluded from these conversations?

Another example is Rice, which has 4 times the endowment of either TCU and SMU and again, like SMU a similar past with TCU until 3 years ago.

Thinsg achange over time. 15 years ago Oregon, TCU and Baylor were nothing. Heck the only reason that Baylor got into the Big 12 back in 1996 was then Governor Ann Richards was an alumni and agreed to not make a stick about UT, aTm, and TT going if they included Baylor.

By closing off the playoffs you preclude the chance of any team ever working their way towards the top. Nobody is saying it is easy to g=move up in national relevance but it is possible and has been done.

So you'd rather play the odds of sticking around to make it into the top 8 best teams in the country?

[JTApps1]

So Boise going 10-2 then beating Arizona in the Fiesta Bowl is now considered just a "not bad" season? Wow...

Much talk about Boise St - deservedly so. Let's also remember that TCU was not in a power conference until 2012. Much can change in a few years. It would be wrong to completely exclude the G5 schools in an 8 or 16 team playoff.

Yep, just like Utah was on the outside when they beat Bama in the Sugar Bowl.

Who is to say that Boise this year wasn't better than several teams that either were in the 4 team playoff or would have been in an 8 team playoff? A pretty strong case could be made that they are better than 4 of the P5 teams in the Big 6 bowls this year. They beat Arizona so they are out. That leaves Ole Miss, FSU, Miss. State, GT, Mich. State, Baylor, Bama. I think they are as deserving as 2 or 3 of those which is all they need to be in the top 8.

I'm not including Oregon or Ohio St.