New playoff structure?

[WVAPPeer]

Many have had comments regarding this item and I thought having it in a separate topic might help the discussion
I think we'll have more about this in the lead up to the national championship.
1. I haven't read anything in the last week or so but the last real discussion I read and heard were about the perceived hangups.
2. It has to be a unanimous vote from the committee and if that happens it must be a unanimous vote by the university presidents. That in itself is going to be hard to pull of.
3. The experts I have heard say it will either be 12 or it will stay at 4. Nothing in between. Why, I don't know.
4. The real problem seems to be the two camps... Automatic Qualifiers vs. 12 teams selected similar to how they do the 4 now. And how many automatic qualifiers if that route is taken?
Intetested in seeing if we have some solid ideas.

[BambooRdApp]

Personally, I do not believe there should be any automatic bids. If the ACC, Big 12, etc have terrible years, they should be out, etc. I do believe that a G5 team would need to have at least one quality P5 win and play at least 2 P5 and win. Not a requirement. Just personal opinion. Even when CCU went undefeated, they played no one but us of significance.. and we are G5 which does hold much weight with committee. I do not believe they would have gotten into 12 team playoff due schedule no matter what the polls had them ranked. Just my opinion

[/\PP ST/\TE GRAD 09]

I'm not in favor of expanding the playoffs. Not enough close games with the current system, players continue to skip bowl games to protect their draft stock...I could see a player having a beast first round game then possibly saying, I don't want to risk it for a second round game.

Occasionally the 4,5 & 6 seeds are controversial, but nothing I feel would have changed outcomes had the seeding been different.

[AppGrad78]

If you like seeing Alabama and Clemson and Ohio State and Oklahoma and Georgia duke it out for the national championship every year, then keep it at four teams. Barring a Cincinnati-like miracle, that’s what you’ll get. Elite recruits know their best chance of playing on the biggest stage is by signing with one of these schools. But if you like seeing the rest of FBS recruit a better brand of athlete and theoretically have a better chance of making the playoffs, then a 12-team playoff with auto-bids to the six highest-ranked conference champions is the way to go.

[HighlandsApp]

I'm not in favor of expanding the playoffs. Not enough close games with the current system, players continue to skip bowl games to protect their draft stock...I could see a player having a beast first round game then possibly saying, I don't want to risk it for a second round game.

Occasionally the 4,5 & 6 seeds are controversial, but nothing I feel would have changed outcomes had the seeding been different.

The players may play in their bowl games if that game is a playoff game and not to some meaningless something. The 14 playoff has definitely diminished prestige of the old classic bowls on New Year's Day not saying that that's a bad thing. Just ask the Rose bowl. Ohio State fans didn't care and didn't go.

[bigdaddyg]

I really can’t see an expansion beyond 4 anytime soon. It would get ridiculous to play 12 games, a CCG then 3-4 more games to include a couple of blowouts. Even the most loyal App fans have got to have some sense of reality. Let’s say we double our budget and expand our stadium to 35,000 capacity Boone ain’t getting that much bigger and we are not going to enter a larger TV market. We used to compare ourselves to Boise who had a short run years ago. Are they still nationally relevant as far as top 8 goes?

I think that NIL and the portal have both killed G5 chances (and lots of fringe P5 as well). The big boys send guys to the pros then reload. Now they can also pluck a few good transfers as well and keep on rolling. We talk about improved recruiting classes but even our best rosters have only a few guys who might see the field for Alabama. I simply don’t get the obsession with playing for the NC. There are probably 75% of the current P5’s who have almost no shot.

I would not mind if the bowls were predetermined each year with ranking. Let the top 4 (if it doesn’t change) play as they do now then let 5-6 play in the Rose, Sugar or whatever that bowl is chosen, then move down the bowl ranking. If we go crazy and win every game that includes some big P5 games and end up ranked like 12th we get the 4th rated bowl which would be like the Orange, Fiesta, etc.

[bcoach]

I really can’t see an expansion beyond 4 anytime soon. It would get ridiculous to play 12 games, a CCG then 3-4 more games to include a couple of blowouts. Even the most loyal App fans have got to have some sense of reality. Let’s say we double our budget and expand our stadium to 35,000 capacity Boone ain’t getting that much bigger and we are not going to enter a larger TV market. We used to compare ourselves to Boise who had a short run years ago. Are they still nationally relevant as far as top 8 goes?

I think that NIL and the portal have both killed G5 chances (and lots of fringe P5 as well). The big boys send guys to the pros then reload. Now they can also pluck a few good transfers as well and keep on rolling. We talk about improved recruiting classes but even our best rosters have only a few guys who might see the field for Alabama. I simply don’t get the obsession with playing for the NC. There are probably 75% of the current P5’s who have almost no shot.

I would not mind if the bowls were predetermined each year with ranking. Let the top 4 (if it doesn’t change) play as they do now then let 5-6 play in the Rose, Sugar or whatever that bowl is chosen, then move down the bowl ranking. If we go crazy and win every game that includes some big P5 games and end up ranked like 12th we get the 4th rated bowl which would be like the Orange, Fiesta, etc.

Very good points all the way but what really ends everything is your fourth sentence.

[Saint3333]

Expand it to the top 8 no auto bids.

[hapapp]

I have no illusions that we would make the playoffs anytime soon. However, I would like to see the expansion take place just to make the process more interesting. I'll likely watch next Monday night but I'm not that thrilled about it. Even with expansion the championship game is likely to involve the same small group of elite programs but along the way it could be more interesting in terms of the build up.

[bigdaddyg]

Imagine watching the NFC and AFC championship games one day then a couple of regular NFL games the next that mean nothing except for maybe the excitement of the fan bases of those teams. That’s how I viewed the playoff and the NY’s day games yesterday. Those big bowl games used to feel more special. Basically there are 4 teams who typically would have been playing in the big bowls who were replaced.

[/\PP ST/\TE GRAD 09]

If you like seeing Alabama and Clemson and Ohio State and Oklahoma and Georgia duke it out for the national championship every year, then keep it at four teams. Barring a Cincinnati-like miracle, that’s what you’ll get. Elite recruits know their best chance of playing on the biggest stage is by signing with one of these schools. But if you like seeing the rest of FBS recruit a better brand of athlete and theoretically have a better chance of making the playoffs, then a 12-team playoff with auto-bids to the six highest-ranked conference champions is the way to go.

So you add more teams to the playoffs, but Bama, UGA, and Clemson still make the playoffs. Where is the advantage then to the other schools? You really think Bama is losing recruits when they can say they make the playoffs consistently, likely still win titles, add more players to the NFL, have Heisman winners, and have many prime time games? Don't think so.

Also, your scenario leaves 6 at large bids. You think there's controversy now with top 4, imagine the chaos of awarding 6 at large bids.

[/\PP ST/\TE GRAD 09]

I have no illusions that we would make the playoffs anytime soon. However, I would like to see the expansion take place just to make the process more interesting. I'll likely watch next Monday night but I'm not that thrilled about it. Even with expansion the championship game is likely to involve the same small group of elite programs but along the way it could be more interesting in terms of the build up.

Or it could just be more blow out games. Since the playoff expansion 2 shutout semifinal games, only 3 decided by a touchdown or less, and 3 games where the losing team only kicked field goals.

[WVAPPeer]

I think the problem with auto bids is maybe this is an example. Big 12--- Baylor finishes the season at 8-0 and everyone else finishes up beating each other (and here's my dream) WVU finishes 2nd at 4-4 because of tie-breakers and then upsets Baylor in the title game. WVU gets the auto bid

[spacemonkey]

I have no illusions that we would make the playoffs anytime soon. However, I would like to see the expansion take place just to make the process more interesting. I'll likely watch next Monday night but I'm not that thrilled about it. Even with expansion the championship game is likely to involve the same small group of elite programs but along the way it could be more interesting in terms of the build up.

This is where I am about expansion...I want to see 3 thru 12 (prefer 3 - 16) settled on the field. I think it is the only way g5 ever get respect. I get tired of the "you didn't play anyone" and the "They didn't care in that bowl"

[hapapp]

I have no illusions that we would make the playoffs anytime soon. However, I would like to see the expansion take place just to make the process more interesting. I'll likely watch next Monday night but I'm not that thrilled about it. Even with expansion the championship game is likely to involve the same small group of elite programs but along the way it could be more interesting in terms of the build up.

Or it could just be more blow out games. Since the playoff expansion 2 shutout semifinal games, only 3 decided by a touchdown or less, and 3 games where the losing team only kicked field goals.

It very well could. Though a 12 team field with the top 4 receiving a bye could at least create some interest in the early round games. Perhaps, expansion proves to be just more of the same but at least there would be some different teams involved and an upset or two could happen along the way. It seems to work at every other level. Not sure why FBS football should be different than every other team sport played at the college level.

[WASU 93]

I really can’t see an expansion beyond 4 anytime soon. It would get ridiculous to play 12 games, a CCG then 3-4 more games to include a couple of blowouts. Even the most loyal App fans have got to have some sense of reality. Let’s say we double our budget and expand our stadium to 35,000 capacity Boone ain’t getting that much bigger and we are not going to enter a larger TV market. We used to compare ourselves to Boise who had a short run years ago. Are they still nationally relevant as far as top 8 goes?

I think that NIL and the portal have both killed G5 chances (and lots of fringe P5 as well). The big boys send guys to the pros then reload. Now they can also pluck a few good transfers as well and keep on rolling. We talk about improved recruiting classes but even our best rosters have only a few guys who might see the field for Alabama. I simply don’t get the obsession with playing for the NC. There are probably 75% of the current P5’s who have almost no shot.

I would not mind if the bowls were predetermined each year with ranking. Let the top 4 (if it doesn’t change) play as they do now then let 5-6 play in the Rose, Sugar or whatever that bowl is chosen, then move down the bowl ranking. If we go crazy and win every game that includes some big P5 games and end up ranked like 12th we get the 4th rated bowl which would be like the Orange, Fiesta, etc.

Boise finished ranked in the top 11 in five of the six seasons from 2006 to 2011. They had two undefeated seasons, three 12-1 seasons and a 10-3 season during that stretch and finished the undefeated seasons with victories in the Fiesta Bowl. From 2002 to 2020, they were ranked in the AP Poll at some point every season (under three different head coaches).

I think that's the standard to shoot for. Even with that, I don't see that the G5 teams will have the depth to advance through more than two rounds of a 12-Team playoff. With bigger, stronger athletes, there were a ton of injuries in yesterday's Rose and Sugar Bowls. Most likely, all 4 of those teams (Utah, Ohio State, Baylor and Mississippi) would have been in an expanded playoff.

I think the one place where the portal may benefit the G5's in on the players we are in the running on from a recruiting standpoint, but lose initially to a P5. If those players don't find success/playing time, they may wear the Black and Gold for two or three seasons.

[T-Dog]

Using the current lack of competitiveness in semifinals against expansion isn't fair IMO.

I feel like if the playoffs required even the top seeds to win 3 games in a row, it would level the playing field because coaches like Saban and his dozens of analysts wouldn't have four weeks to prep beforehand.

Every other level of football does playoffs and do it with more than four teams. Rec, high school, NAIA, D3, D2, D1 FCS, the CFL, NFL and whatever spring leagues pop up from time to time.

ESPN is one of the biggest reasons for opt outs, IMO. They shoehorn CFB Playoff talk into every CFB broadcast they have. If App is beating Texas State by three scores in the second quarter on Thursday, former SEC quarterback Sterling Garrett the third is discussing how Bama's offense matches up with Ohio State's defense. They've taught their audience, including impressionable young men playing college football, that if you're not one of the four teams in the playoff its broadcasts, then you don't matter.

One of the biggest reasons I believe expansion will happen sooner than later is because this year, three of the five P5's didn't make the playoffs. Many years two of them don't make it. With the G5 on their side, two of the P5s can swing a vote in their favor (don't remember the voting shares, but the G5 are a swing vote).

[WASU 93]

Using the current lack of competitiveness in semifinals against expansion isn't fair IMO.

I feel like if the playoffs required even the top seeds to win 3 games in a row, it would level the playing field because coaches like Saban and his dozens of analysts wouldn't have four weeks to prep beforehand.

Every other level of football does playoffs and do it with more than four teams. Rec, high school, NAIA, D3, D2, D1 FCS, the CFL, NFL and whatever spring leagues pop up from time to time.

ESPN is one of the biggest reasons for opt outs, IMO. They shoehorn CFB Playoff talk into every CFB broadcast they have. If App is beating Texas State by three scores in the second quarter on Thursday, former SEC quarterback Sterling Garrett the third is discussing how Bama's offense matches up with Ohio State's defense. They've taught their audience, including impressionable young men playing college football, that if you're not one of the four teams in the playoff its broadcasts, then you don't matter.

One of the biggest reasons I believe expansion will happen sooner than later is because this year, three of the five P5's didn't make the playoffs. Many years two of them don't make it. With the G5 on their side, two of the P5s can swing a vote in their favor (don't remember the voting shares, but the G5 are a swing vote).

The difference between FBS and every other level of football, is that all of those other levels do not have a class system (where each class doesn't get their own playoff). In North Carolina, they even added additional classes just for football, so they can pull in more revenue and involve more teams. But, FBS has the P5/G5 designation where half the schools only combine for one "swing vote". As long as cash is king and big brother is ruling the roost, there's no incentive to let little brother in the party on a regular basis.

[bigdaddyg]

During our peak FCS years (and probably even now) there were more or less P’s and G’s among the member schools. Those lesser talented schools earned bids to the playoffs, often got drilled but still got a shot. How many first round blowouts do we see (and saw)? It doesn’t matter because they get a chance and in FCS everyone is still at the same level. I’ve said it many times, the fact there exists the labels of G5 and P5 should not be allowed. Either we are on the same level with Alabama or we ain’t.

[huskie3]

Increase to 12 teams - all conference champs qualify. Top 2 2nd places teams with best record are other 2. No independent teams, if they want in join a conference.