Jose. Best App passing qb in recent memory?

[t4pizza]

I could be entirely wrong here but I think that on each play, there are multiple reads that Joey can make and decide where he wants to go with the ball. He seems to decide presnap who he is going to based on the look he gets. I think the reason we went with the intermediate play in the second half is most likely because it was pointed out to Joey how often those intermediate routes are open as he is forcing the 50/50 ball. Again, I could be wrong but I doubt that when a play is called, that there is only one option to throw it to. That just doesn't make any sense to me.

I doubt he would just force the 50/50 ball based on what we've seen. And if the coaches were seeing the intermediate routes open earlier, surely someone told him on the sideline when he called up to Ponce? No? I think the game plan was to take deep shots, even if you don't connect, to get the running game going. ECU's run defense was really good against Michigan and Marshall so you had to soften them up by showing a willingness to attack deep and that's what Joey was doing, at the instruction of the coaching staff. Then they changed tact and went intermediate, likely on routes to target safeties as well, which had the same effect but with a higher completion percentage.

I think Joey has a lot of freedom on any given play but you don't keep taking those shots drive after drive if a coach doesn't want it.

I agree that the 50/50 is part of the play but all I am saying is that there are other potential passes he could be making on every play as well. I haven't rewatched the game but my memory is that on that 50/50 pass out of the endzone on second down (play before the int) there was an open Tight End (could be another play that I am thinking of), there is no way that he is simply told throw the 50/50 on this play even if you have a wide open receiver somewhere else on the field. I just don't buy that. I think the play is called and one of the options is the 50/50 and we have a true gunslinger that likes his odds with those passes so he airs it out. It is up to the coaches to let him know that he has other options and I think that is exactly what happened and why he used the intermediate pass more often later in the game. Until a coach speaks directly to this, we are both just guessing. I just can't believe we would ever run a pass play where our qb only has 1 option with the ball, especially if that option is 30 yards down the field.

The end of regulation against JMU shows that this is indeed what they ask him to do.

Again, we will have to agree to disagree. Just because he threw it on that play (resulting in an interception when we only needed 10 yards for FG range) does not mean that was his only option and he was told to only throw there. Until I hear a coach say otherwise, I seriously doubt we ever have a passing play with only 1 option, especially with that option being a 50/50 pass.

[ASUTodd]

I could be entirely wrong here but I think that on each play, there are multiple reads that Joey can make and decide where he wants to go with the ball. He seems to decide presnap who he is going to based on the look he gets. I think the reason we went with the intermediate play in the second half is most likely because it was pointed out to Joey how often those intermediate routes are open as he is forcing the 50/50 ball. Again, I could be wrong but I doubt that when a play is called, that there is only one option to throw it to. That just doesn't make any sense to me.

I doubt he would just force the 50/50 ball based on what we've seen. And if the coaches were seeing the intermediate routes open earlier, surely someone told him on the sideline when he called up to Ponce? No? I think the game plan was to take deep shots, even if you don't connect, to get the running game going. ECU's run defense was really good against Michigan and Marshall so you had to soften them up by showing a willingness to attack deep and that's what Joey was doing, at the instruction of the coaching staff. Then they changed tact and went intermediate, likely on routes to target safeties as well, which had the same effect but with a higher completion percentage.

I think Joey has a lot of freedom on any given play but you don't keep taking those shots drive after drive if a coach doesn't want it.

I agree that the 50/50 is part of the play but all I am saying is that there are other potential passes he could be making on every play as well. I haven't rewatched the game but my memory is that on that 50/50 pass out of the endzone on second down (play before the int) there was an open Tight End (could be another play that I am thinking of), there is no way that he is simply told throw the 50/50 on this play even if you have a wide open receiver somewhere else on the field. I just don't buy that. I think the play is called and one of the options is the 50/50 and we have a true gunslinger that likes his odds with those passes so he airs it out. It is up to the coaches to let him know that he has other options and I think that is exactly what happened and why he used the intermediate pass more often later in the game. Until a coach speaks directly to this, we are both just guessing. I just can't believe we would ever run a pass play where our qb only has 1 option with the ball, especially if that option is 30 yards down the field.

The end of regulation against JMU shows that this is indeed what they ask him to do.

Again, we will have to agree to disagree. Just because he threw it on that play (resulting in an interception when we only needed 10 yards for FG range) does not mean that was his only option and he was told to only throw there. Until I hear a coach say otherwise, I seriously doubt we ever have a passing play with only 1 option, especially with that option being a 50/50 pass.

Hasn't Clark been mentioning that they have worked with Joey and he is finding his "check down" a lot more now instead of slinging it?

[ericsaid]

I could be entirely wrong here but I think that on each play, there are multiple reads that Joey can make and decide where he wants to go with the ball. He seems to decide presnap who he is going to based on the look he gets. I think the reason we went with the intermediate play in the second half is most likely because it was pointed out to Joey how often those intermediate routes are open as he is forcing the 50/50 ball. Again, I could be wrong but I doubt that when a play is called, that there is only one option to throw it to. That just doesn't make any sense to me.

I doubt he would just force the 50/50 ball based on what we've seen. And if the coaches were seeing the intermediate routes open earlier, surely someone told him on the sideline when he called up to Ponce? No? I think the game plan was to take deep shots, even if you don't connect, to get the running game going. ECU's run defense was really good against Michigan and Marshall so you had to soften them up by showing a willingness to attack deep and that's what Joey was doing, at the instruction of the coaching staff. Then they changed tact and went intermediate, likely on routes to target safeties as well, which had the same effect but with a higher completion percentage.

I think Joey has a lot of freedom on any given play but you don't keep taking those shots drive after drive if a coach doesn't want it.

I agree that the 50/50 is part of the play but all I am saying is that there are other potential passes he could be making on every play as well. I haven't rewatched the game but my memory is that on that 50/50 pass out of the endzone on second down (play before the int) there was an open Tight End (could be another play that I am thinking of), there is no way that he is simply told throw the 50/50 on this play even if you have a wide open receiver somewhere else on the field. I just don't buy that. I think the play is called and one of the options is the 50/50 and we have a true gunslinger that likes his odds with those passes so he airs it out. It is up to the coaches to let him know that he has other options and I think that is exactly what happened and why he used the intermediate pass more often later in the game. Until a coach speaks directly to this, we are both just guessing. I just can't believe we would ever run a pass play where our qb only has 1 option with the ball, especially if that option is 30 yards down the field.

The end of regulation against JMU shows that this is indeed what they ask him to do.

Again, we will have to agree to disagree. Just because he threw it on that play (resulting in an interception when we only needed 10 yards for FG range) does not mean that was his only option and he was told to only throw there. Until I hear a coach say otherwise, I seriously doubt we ever have a passing play with only 1 option, especially with that option being a 50/50 pass.

Did you not watch Clark or Joey's post game press conference? They literally said they had a shot called and that if it was 1 on 1 with no safety help, Joey should throw that ball. So yeah, they said go with the 50/50 ball, that's the read. FIRST READ.

We saw this with Ponce in 2021 so I don't know why it's surprising.

[ericsaid]

I doubt he would just force the 50/50 ball based on what we've seen. And if the coaches were seeing the intermediate routes open earlier, surely someone told him on the sideline when he called up to Ponce? No? I think the game plan was to take deep shots, even if you don't connect, to get the running game going. ECU's run defense was really good against Michigan and Marshall so you had to soften them up by showing a willingness to attack deep and that's what Joey was doing, at the instruction of the coaching staff. Then they changed tact and went intermediate, likely on routes to target safeties as well, which had the same effect but with a higher completion percentage.

I think Joey has a lot of freedom on any given play but you don't keep taking those shots drive after drive if a coach doesn't want it.

I agree that the 50/50 is part of the play but all I am saying is that there are other potential passes he could be making on every play as well. I haven't rewatched the game but my memory is that on that 50/50 pass out of the endzone on second down (play before the int) there was an open Tight End (could be another play that I am thinking of), there is no way that he is simply told throw the 50/50 on this play even if you have a wide open receiver somewhere else on the field. I just don't buy that. I think the play is called and one of the options is the 50/50 and we have a true gunslinger that likes his odds with those passes so he airs it out. It is up to the coaches to let him know that he has other options and I think that is exactly what happened and why he used the intermediate pass more often later in the game. Until a coach speaks directly to this, we are both just guessing. I just can't believe we would ever run a pass play where our qb only has 1 option with the ball, especially if that option is 30 yards down the field.

The end of regulation against JMU shows that this is indeed what they ask him to do.

Again, we will have to agree to disagree. Just because he threw it on that play (resulting in an interception when we only needed 10 yards for FG range) does not mean that was his only option and he was told to only throw there. Until I hear a coach say otherwise, I seriously doubt we ever have a passing play with only 1 option, especially with that option being a 50/50 pass.

Hasn't Clark been mentioning that they have worked with Joey and he is finding his "check down" a lot more now instead of slinging it?

Yes. But he also said that on the 50/50 ball to end the drive in regulation against JMU that it was a called shot. If there was no help over top, sling it out there. So while they are being more measured in their general approach to driving the field, there are play calls that call for a 50/50 ball if you get one on one with Stroman or Kaedin, it seems.

Personally, I don't care. App doesn't win 10 games in 2021 without the 50/50 balls. Just saying that it what the call is. It isn't just Joey going out there and saying "f*** the reads, I'm sending it".

[t4pizza]

I doubt he would just force the 50/50 ball based on what we've seen. And if the coaches were seeing the intermediate routes open earlier, surely someone told him on the sideline when he called up to Ponce? No? I think the game plan was to take deep shots, even if you don't connect, to get the running game going. ECU's run defense was really good against Michigan and Marshall so you had to soften them up by showing a willingness to attack deep and that's what Joey was doing, at the instruction of the coaching staff. Then they changed tact and went intermediate, likely on routes to target safeties as well, which had the same effect but with a higher completion percentage.

I think Joey has a lot of freedom on any given play but you don't keep taking those shots drive after drive if a coach doesn't want it.

I agree that the 50/50 is part of the play but all I am saying is that there are other potential passes he could be making on every play as well. I haven't rewatched the game but my memory is that on that 50/50 pass out of the endzone on second down (play before the int) there was an open Tight End (could be another play that I am thinking of), there is no way that he is simply told throw the 50/50 on this play even if you have a wide open receiver somewhere else on the field. I just don't buy that. I think the play is called and one of the options is the 50/50 and we have a true gunslinger that likes his odds with those passes so he airs it out. It is up to the coaches to let him know that he has other options and I think that is exactly what happened and why he used the intermediate pass more often later in the game. Until a coach speaks directly to this, we are both just guessing. I just can't believe we would ever run a pass play where our qb only has 1 option with the ball, especially if that option is 30 yards down the field.

The end of regulation against JMU shows that this is indeed what they ask him to do.

Again, we will have to agree to disagree. Just because he threw it on that play (resulting in an interception when we only needed 10 yards for FG range) does not mean that was his only option and he was told to only throw there. Until I hear a coach say otherwise, I seriously doubt we ever have a passing play with only 1 option, especially with that option being a 50/50 pass.

Did you not watch Clark or Joey's post game press conference? They literally said they had a shot called and that if it was 1 on 1 with no safety help, Joey should throw that ball. So yeah, they said go with the 50/50 ball, that's the read. FIRST READ.

We saw this with Ponce in 2021 so I don't know why it's surprising.

Yes, it is his FIRST read, but not his only read. That is my entire point, there are always multiple reads on every passing play. I think Joey just likes his chances on the 50/50 and coaches clearly have faith that he can make it BUT if it is not there, he always has other reads he can go to. That being said, I don't think there is a 50/50 that Joey doesn't think he can make which is probably why during our winning streak we saw less of those plays called and more crossing and slant routes across the middle, the coaches seemingly took that option away. They have now worked it back into the game plan starting with JMU and and also Ga Southern. My best guess is because Joey has done a great job of learning to make reads and go through his progressions and has earned the trust that he will make the right read. Again, this is all pure speculation on all of our parts.

[Yosefus]

I'm not knocking the offensive play calling this year. Saw enough up the middle runs on 3rd and 4th down last year to last me a lifetime. We took what opportunity we had most of the time and made the best of it. Joey grew experience and confidence as the season went on and it showed.