What are the "ugly truths" about the football program?

[fjblair]

Someone posted on the Today I Give My All Facebook page that our football program is lacking a good nutrition program. Specifically that our program is not equivalent to a D III program. That players are scraping to find food and/or eating unhealthy.
If true, it would appear that could have a direct impact on performance on the field... stronger, faster, longer stints on field, etc.
I believe it was the parent of a recent former player.
Just curious if this is an accurate perception.

Absolutely, unequivocally false statement.

I was going to say they did a long segment a few years ago on “App Fuel” and they’ve had a full time nutritionist for a while

Current offensive lineman Thornton Gentry's Dad.

Understand we may have a nutritionist. I took the post on Facebook that the actual volume of food needed for a proper nutrition to be a D1 caliber player is not there throughout the year and not adequate when it is there. I have no idea as I do not follow nutrition of players. Although we may have nutritionist...if not getting enough of the correct foods...seems it could be a problem.

They can eat all day and night if they want. They have full access to both dining halls.

[Stonewall]

That’s my take. The unlimited plan. Take the AppleCart. I don’t know who gets how much NIL but a lot of them do.

[huskie3]

The question may have more to do with where the athlete lives. If off campus he may not be taking advantage of all that is available.

[ASUTodd]

https://appstatesports.com/sports/2020/ ... ition.aspx
Looks like she's still with us....

[AppDawg]

Re: Nutrition

I took the post to be the program is not providing the actual food/meals to players and/or the means to purchase.

Based on a tour of our facility several years ago, what we were told, our nutritionist makes a weekly grocery list/meal plan for each player identifying what they need to eat to achieve their stated goals. AppFuel is available but only a piece of the equation.

It is the responsibility of each player to execute that meal plan.

[yosef69]

If this is true it is absolutely unacceptable and is definitely part of the reason for our suck.

[Yosef10]

Yeah, not great depending on what the programs goals are. Firing Clark would indicate the admin has lofty goals - competing with AAC schools and Boise, wanting the G5 playoff spot, but I do wonder if finances make that somewhat unachievable on a consistent basis.

Related, there was a media member talking with a guy currently considering joining Loggains staff and while there are expectations in Boone (hence the firing), there are financial realities that haven’t been met.

[The Rock]

Loggains only knows NFL & SEC football as a staff member or player. I would expect the expectations & "care" factor to be increased by this staff. Even if he retains some, I believe we'll see a lot of the things fans want; spring game, more media availability, uptick in recruiting.

The only difference between Drinkwitz & Loggains is the fact that Drinkwitz seemed hungrier initially. He came in with a plan and kicked this place into high gear immediately. With Drinkwitz you could tell he was not planning on staying here for long.

Loggains has been hired only for about 48 hours so still early to tell how fast he wants to get started but with the portal situation we're not exactly in the same scenario as when Drink was hired. You may see Loggains retain some staff simply because he needs positions filled to help with recruiting starting tomorrow.

Recruiting & Development carry your program. You can be a an average recruiter if you are a phenomenal developer. You can still win. You can do the same vice versa & win. You just can't be average at both. The great teams are phenomenal at both.

Drinkwitz set Clark up for failure really. Drink handed the keys to a Ferrari to Clark but in reality that Ferrari was out of gas & needed an oil change. Drinkwitz got the keys during a time where the roster was loaded. His strength program was about maintaining & not developing. He wanted to go to the NY6 that year & it worked aside from "Love Week" which cost us.

Clark was given a roster still competitive but lacked a year of development really. Then he tried to fix it & he just did not do a good enough job. He tried to fix it again & ran out of time. I believe Matt Greenhalgh was the best hire he made here. Given more time I think he could have fixed the development piece quicker & potentially still have a job.

This is probably what he argued as well, but ultimately that doesn't factor in the on-field performance or decisions, which cannot be ignored. He didn't have a huge network. His staff hires seemed lazy. So he put all his eggs in just recruiting bigger & more highly touted recruits & not enough in developing them or making the required staff adjustments to fix issues before they were exposed. We were complacent & simply not hungry enough. He was, I believe, but not everyone around him. At the end of the day while Clark could have been a great face & leader of this program, he didn't live up to the standard.

There is a lot of wisdom in what you have said, I believe the Ferrari needed to have the engine rebuilt, bald tires replaced, and a new clutch as well as having it pulled out of a ditch. In some ways, Drinkwitz may have ruined our fan base. However, we will recover and when we do, we will be better than anyone can imagine...

Get a grip. It wasn’t that bad

Clark inherited: Darrynton Evans, hennigan, Zac Thomas, a good OL, sutton, Malik Williams, Nate Noel, jolly, meech, McLeod, Dmarco Jackson, cam peoples, Milan Tucker, Jalen Virgil, etc.

Count the nfl players on Clark’s roster.

He inherited a ferrari that maybe, MAYBE, needed an oil change.

He coached the same team drink coached for 2 years.

Darrynton Evans left early for the NFL after the ‘19 season. Never played for Clark as HC

[The Rock]

IMG_3483.jpeg

If this is true it is absolutely unacceptable and is definitely part of the reason for our suck.

I have a lot of thoughts about this.
1:we give them a full scholarship and probably NIL. Is it Apps responsibility to feed them every single meal year round?
2: they mentioned that they tried to purchase a meal plan but was told they couldn’t because he lived off campus. I don’t know who told him that or if someone actually did, but either way, it’s incorrect. Anyone can buy a meal plan. There are a lot of options for plans both on and off campus students.

Yes nutrition is very important and I know we require a lot of very specific diets, but again is it reasonable to expect someone else to pay for every meal you eat for 3-5 years just because you play a sport?

[yosef69]

IMG_3483.jpeg

If this is true it is absolutely unacceptable and is definitely part of the reason for our suck.

I have a lot of thoughts about this.
1:we give them a full scholarship and probably NIL. Is it Apps responsibility to feed them every single meal year round?
2: they mentioned that they tried to purchase a meal plan but was told they couldn’t because he lived off campus. I don’t know who told him that or if someone actually did, but either way, it’s incorrect. Anyone can buy a meal plan. There are a lot of options for plans both on and off campus students.

Yes nutrition is very important and I know we require a lot of very specific diets, but again is it reasonable to expect someone else to pay for every meal you eat for 3-5 years just because you play a sport?

I mean, kind of. Do you think gentry’s NIL money is enough to keep him at 305 pounds with most of that being muscle?

What if we have a good player that is from a poor family and he doesn’t get substantial NIL?

[yosef69]

Loggains only knows NFL & SEC football as a staff member or player. I would expect the expectations & "care" factor to be increased by this staff. Even if he retains some, I believe we'll see a lot of the things fans want; spring game, more media availability, uptick in recruiting.

The only difference between Drinkwitz & Loggains is the fact that Drinkwitz seemed hungrier initially. He came in with a plan and kicked this place into high gear immediately. With Drinkwitz you could tell he was not planning on staying here for long.

Loggains has been hired only for about 48 hours so still early to tell how fast he wants to get started but with the portal situation we're not exactly in the same scenario as when Drink was hired. You may see Loggains retain some staff simply because he needs positions filled to help with recruiting starting tomorrow.

Recruiting & Development carry your program. You can be a an average recruiter if you are a phenomenal developer. You can still win. You can do the same vice versa & win. You just can't be average at both. The great teams are phenomenal at both.

Drinkwitz set Clark up for failure really. Drink handed the keys to a Ferrari to Clark but in reality that Ferrari was out of gas & needed an oil change. Drinkwitz got the keys during a time where the roster was loaded. His strength program was about maintaining & not developing. He wanted to go to the NY6 that year & it worked aside from "Love Week" which cost us.

Clark was given a roster still competitive but lacked a year of development really. Then he tried to fix it & he just did not do a good enough job. He tried to fix it again & ran out of time. I believe Matt Greenhalgh was the best hire he made here. Given more time I think he could have fixed the development piece quicker & potentially still have a job.

This is probably what he argued as well, but ultimately that doesn't factor in the on-field performance or decisions, which cannot be ignored. He didn't have a huge network. His staff hires seemed lazy. So he put all his eggs in just recruiting bigger & more highly touted recruits & not enough in developing them or making the required staff adjustments to fix issues before they were exposed. We were complacent & simply not hungry enough. He was, I believe, but not everyone around him. At the end of the day while Clark could have been a great face & leader of this program, he didn't live up to the standard.

There is a lot of wisdom in what you have said, I believe the Ferrari needed to have the engine rebuilt, bald tires replaced, and a new clutch as well as having it pulled out of a ditch. In some ways, Drinkwitz may have ruined our fan base. However, we will recover and when we do, we will be better than anyone can imagine...

Get a grip. It wasn’t that bad

Clark inherited: Darrynton Evans, hennigan, Zac Thomas, a good OL, sutton, Malik Williams, Nate Noel, jolly, meech, McLeod, Dmarco Jackson, cam peoples, Milan Tucker, Jalen Virgil, etc.

Count the nfl players on Clark’s roster.

He inherited a ferrari that maybe, MAYBE, needed an oil change.

He coached the same team drink coached for 2 years.

Darrynton Evans left early for the NFL after the ‘19 season. Never played for Clark as HC

Nitpick. Point stands

[yosef69]

Yeah, not great depending on what the programs goals are. Firing Clark would indicate the admin has lofty goals - competing with AAC schools and Boise, wanting the G5 playoff spot, but I do wonder if finances make that somewhat unachievable on a consistent basis.

Related, there was a media member talking with a guy currently considering joining Loggains staff and while there are expectations in Boone (hence the firing), there are financial realities that haven’t been met.

Where can I see that interview?

[DenverOfTheEast]

One thing Stonewall shared today after the Loggains news broke was that he "told us the ugly truth."

That made me think, what are the "ugly truths" about App State football that caused the team to miss bowl eligibility 2 of the last 3 years and slip from a Top 20 team over the last five years?

-

To me, as someone who watched every presser and every Mountaineer Talk, it seemed that Clark didn't put himself out there as much as he should. Most other coaches have two press conferences a week. Clark just had one and staff was ready to end it after 10-12 minutes. Have a presser on Wednesday.

I think that would help build more fan trust since he could give more injury updates. One of the biggest transgressions was saying "We came out of Clemson healthy" and then 5-6 starters were out at ECU due to injury.

I also remember how much whining he later did about doing all sorts of media after the Texas A&M game. He whined in that "I had to do XX interviews this week, but it wasn't a distraction" double speak.

Clark occasionally did off-mountain radio and such, but it seemed inconsistent. I know an App alum who was scheduled to have Clark in August, but then the Santana Hopper helmet incident leaked that day and the interview was canceled. No one called them to reschedule.

I want Loggains doing every radio hit possible this week. I know he'll be portal crootin hard, but this is immense. Have him do the rounds before the Yosef Club tour this spring promoting the vents. Same after the schedule release. Before and after spring practice. Get him out there.

Another media suggestion is to have Media Day on a Saturday, not a weekday. Reach out to Charlotte, Asheville, Triad and Tri-Cities media and invite them up. Invite some national reporters to spend a day and write a "Day in the life of the App State Head Coach" bits. And make sure to not have Media Day while the leafblower is running in the background again.

Make sure to coach him to never say "all of our goals are ahead of us" and "the standards is the standard."

Take advantage of that New Coach Smell.

-

There are others, such as revamping the prospect camps as I've heard negative reviews from parents whose kids went in the last 3 years.


What say you?

This isn't a Ugly truth T-Dog, this is your opinion.

Now the actual truth of your overall media interview(above post) is simply this: David Ware of App State Mania is consistently the only media coverage that covers App State football on a daily basis, recruiting, injuries, game etc.

Sure Watooga Newspaper writes some articles after games or whenever they feel their opinion matters.

Charlotte Observer doesn't come up 321 to write about App State, The WS Journal was the most consistent non mountain paper for a while and I think they cut back coverage, no one from Asheville writes.

As far as injuries that is the whole Head Coach hiding that stuff so the other team can't prepare for a missing player and the other thing is a injury is protected by HIPPA laws and really can't be publicly spoken about specifics, why on TV they say "lower leg injury" without details.

No doubt with a New Coach hire, DG will parade Dowell around the state in the Spring and all the radio shows and David Glenn stuff and Dowell will be all gun hoe for football with new energy and surely he will be opposite of Clark for sure with excitement and hope. Let's see how this is differ next Fall during the season.

They have a post game Saturday press conference and Monday press conference so technically they already have 2 a week...

App State is a regional school - It's not Clarks job or The Head Football Coach job to get press coverage - some of what you wrote is on Joey and matter fact why would Tri Cities cover App State when they ETSU? Charlotte has PRO teams, ACC teams and now Charlotte football to cover plus HS sports, same in the Triad.

Some of what you are writing is not realistic to happen unless you beat Texas AM and then everyone floods the town and leaves in 5 days... it's like the movie CARS with Radiator Springs getting passed by --

I love my movie references, What say you?

[Yosef10]

IMG_3483.jpeg

If this is true it is absolutely unacceptable and is definitely part of the reason for our suck.

I have a lot of thoughts about this.
1:we give them a full scholarship and probably NIL. Is it Apps responsibility to feed them every single meal year round?
2: they mentioned that they tried to purchase a meal plan but was told they couldn’t because he lived off campus. I don’t know who told him that or if someone actually did, but either way, it’s incorrect. Anyone can buy a meal plan. There are a lot of options for plans both on and off campus students.

Yes nutrition is very important and I know we require a lot of very specific diets, but again is it reasonable to expect someone else to pay for every meal you eat for 3-5 years just because you play a sport?

It’s not about what App is and isn’t responsible for. It’s about the program doing everything it can to operate at the highest level. You would never find a nutrition situation like this at a school like Boise, and especially true higher up the food chain you go.

[t4pizza]

IMG_3483.jpeg

If this is true it is absolutely unacceptable and is definitely part of the reason for our suck.

I have a lot of thoughts about this.
1:we give them a full scholarship and probably NIL. Is it Apps responsibility to feed them every single meal year round?
2: they mentioned that they tried to purchase a meal plan but was told they couldn’t because he lived off campus. I don’t know who told him that or if someone actually did, but either way, it’s incorrect. Anyone can buy a meal plan. There are a lot of options for plans both on and off campus students.

Yes nutrition is very important and I know we require a lot of very specific diets, but again is it reasonable to expect someone else to pay for every meal you eat for 3-5 years just because you play a sport?

Yes, it is routine among college athletics to feed the athletes. I am sure we are not the only G5 program that (evidently) doesn't do this but all big P4 schools do. I was shocked to hear in this thread that we don't have a training table for our athletes as it is very common at most schools. What doesn't makes sense to me is why the players living off campus can't eat meals provided for them when they are on campus for class, meetings, walk throughs, after work outs, etc. It would seem to me that every football player is on campus or around the football building for a large part of the day, why don't they have access to food during this time? The post was eye opening for me because I really thought that we were providing meals designed by a nutritionist to are players and not just breakfast. We need to do a lot better on this front.

[Yosef10]

Yeah, not great depending on what the programs goals are. Firing Clark would indicate the admin has lofty goals - competing with AAC schools and Boise, wanting the G5 playoff spot, but I do wonder if finances make that somewhat unachievable on a consistent basis.

Related, there was a media member talking with a guy currently considering joining Loggains staff and while there are expectations in Boone (hence the firing), there are financial realities that haven’t been met.

Where can I see that interview?

There’s a podcast Split Zone Duo. This nugget came from their latest episode. They put out some free stuff, but most of the good stuff is paywalled. Think it’s $10/month. Worth it IMO if you’re interested in college football as a whole.

[311neers]

Current offensive lineman Thornton Gentry's Dad.

Understand we may have a nutritionist. I took the post on Facebook that the actual volume of food needed for a proper nutrition to be a D1 caliber player is not there throughout the year and not adequate when it is there. I have no idea as I do not follow nutrition of players. Although we may have nutritionist...if not getting enough of the correct foods...seems it could be a problem.

True, got to keep them fed properly to maintain weight & strength.

Are you saying that Thornton's dad posted on facebook or that he is the nutritionist? I thought he was the Chapin High Coach.

I believe posted on FB. He is not nutritionist.
I am unable to post the thread here. It is a thread on the Today I Give My All FB group page.
I think the post is an attempt to be well meaning that we need to give more to athletics for better nutrition....but the reference that we are not even at DIII standards does not sound good..
Overall, I was just curious if this is what others think that are "more in the know" than me...

He's been around plenty of programs...Thornton played at State, and the dad had guys end up at South Carolina and other big name schools....so he's probably seeing big name schools and thinking we should have that or strive to have that. I have no intel on the nutrition program, but I doubt it's at the level of NCSU or what Gentry has seen at other programs. Definitely not D3, but maybe we do need to pour more into it.

[bcoach]

I certainly hope a coach would go to admin with this before going to facebook. I also question why he would ever go to facebook with it.

[yosef69]

I certainly hope a coach would go to admin with this before going to facebook. I also question why he would ever go to facebook with it.

It’s not a coach. It’s Thornton gentry’s dad.

[bcoach]

I certainly hope a coach would go to admin with this before going to facebook. I also question why he would ever go to facebook with it.

It’s not a coach. It’s Thornton gentry’s dad.

I thought someone said his dad was a coach.