Southern Miss Game

[APPARJ]

Southern Miss and ODU on the schedule the next two years. Next year we get Southern Miss, ULL, Ark St., Troy, and GSU, what will the excuse be next season?

I think it is unreasonable to spend money you don't have.

If I'm Charlie I'd come up with a stadium plan to do it right, add north end zone seats over the track to connect to both lower sides with club seats at the top. Then present it to the fans and say as soon as we raise 50% of the costs we'll build it, the rest will be paid by the ticket sales of this area.

No doubt the athletic department needs to put together and actual expansion plan which includes removal of the track. So far all of the expansion projects at KBS have been individual projects that didn't match the previous projects. The illustration released a few years ago was little more than a Photoshop mockup done in house. We need an architect to make a master plan including stages of seating to go from 21,500 we have now to 30,000, and then to 40,000+.

I can see the need for 30,000 seats. But 40,000?

I'd rather see a stadium bursting at the seams with rabid fans than aluminum bleachers shining in the sun.

App State has had great fan support for any program, no doubt. But we would be kidding ourselves if we said there was a legitimate demand for a 40,000 seat stadium. If a school like ECU ever comes up the mountain to play I can see over 40,000 pack KBS regardless of seating capacity.

But we want to double seating capacity when the seats aren't full today at 21,500?

No thanks.

[ASUMountaineer]

Southern Miss and ODU on the schedule the next two years. Next year we get Southern Miss, ULL, Ark St., Troy, and GSU, what will the excuse be next season?

I think it remains to be seen whether the FBS schedules as presently constituted will really drive increased attendance and demand. I know many die-hard fans are pumped about playing the better Sun Belt teams, but I have a hard time seeing casual fans getting super excited to play any of the teams you just mentioned (most of whom they probably know very little about, other than GSU). Heck, I follow college football very closely and even I knew next to nothing about anyone in the Sun Belt before App announced we were joining.

That is a very legitimate statement. Before some jump in to criticize you should instead be looking for a solution. There are many fans who have never heard of some of our new opponents and even more who just don't know anything about them. So it is hard to think that the folks who know absolutely nothing about these teams to get real excited. The answer is not to bash those that are just not excited about teams that mean nothing to them. The answer is to give them a reason to get excited. Well would you rather have Coastal is not the answer. EastHall App knew very little about them so how about the folks like me frankly, who just doesn't get too excited about games that ASU is not playing. What I know about Ark ST is that they are in Ark and that is only because there is an Ark in front of the St My point is that most of us have a lot to learn before we can be expected to get really pumped up. That learning will happen but I really don't think it will be an overnight thing but I do hope it will be sooner than later.

Almost three hours between EastHallApp's post and yours. No one jumped in to criticize. I think it will all be ok.

As for his post...I get it. There are some of us crazies that live and breath this stuff non-stop who know about D-II teams because we can't get enough football. I realize that is is a very small minority. I think, in time, these teams will become known if the Sun Belt maintains its current membership for a while. I'm sure the same concerns existed when moving to the SoCon 40+ years ago.

[bcoach]

Yes it does happen on rare occasions. pretty nice when it does.

[Maddog1956]

Southern Miss and ODU on the schedule the next two years. Next year we get Southern Miss, ULL, Ark St., Troy, and GSU, what will the excuse be next season?

I think it is unreasonable to spend money you don't have.

If I'm Charlie I'd come up with a stadium plan to do it right, add north end zone seats over the track to connect to both lower sides with club seats at the top. Then present it to the fans and say as soon as we raise 50% of the costs we'll build it, the rest will be paid by the ticket sales of this area.

I think the Feasibility Report has close to what you're describing, but who knows if it's something that has been really looked at or just artistic liberty taken to sell the plan. The track looks cut off but I guess it could go under or moved.

It looks like it would hold the right number of increased seats (I'm assuming 5k - 7k mainly students) and several club/suite seats. I think the new dorm could hold from 500 - 1000 (Swag) students (I know there is debate about if dorm space needed, but I know after freshman year, many have been turned away, plus we could take in more freshman if we had space).

I don't know how App does it but some places run dorms as a profit/cost center and I think that Athletics would only be responsible for a the additional cost to the dorm.

I wouldn't build anything until we knew we had tickets sales locked in (and it might be good to see a few years at the FBS first) but if that all pans out, I think the drawing is impressive.

[Saint3333]

I may be in the minority, but I think we can do better than that design. I don't like how the dorm cuts down to the east side and think a third deck on the east side should be on an overhang versus further from the field. The less expensive construction methods used on the east deck may prevent that however.

Perhaps the funds for a new dorm to replace Winkler will be used to fund this type of setup and a parking deck will go where Winkler used to be.

I would like the next plan to have two phases so we are thinking ahead versus just adding seats the easiest way possible.

[roachgone]

Re our new opponents. Talked to someone who should know, and they told me that Michigan may be the 3rd best team on our schedule this yr. They think there are 2 sunbelt teams better than Michigan. I realize it will take alittle time to develop rivalries but the is absolutely ZERO doubt that we did the right thing in moving our football program to schools that are our peers in stadium size, enrollment, and fan support. If the BIG boys want to break away and play semi pro football so be it. We at least will be where we should be with the Sunbelt /Conf USA size programs. We can still play one or two "semi pro " college teams for big paydays and still have a chance for an occasional win. We definitely did the right thing and IMHO in a nick of time. It may take a few years but in 3 yrs. or so everybody will agree that we are were we need to be. It is probably very likely that in 5 yrs. or less that Conf. USA and Sunbelt may re organize into 2 more regional conferences and then we will be exactly were we need to be.

[JTApps1]

Southern Miss and ODU on the schedule the next two years. Next year we get Southern Miss, ULL, Ark St., Troy, and GSU, what will the excuse be next season?

I think it is unreasonable to spend money you don't have.

If I'm Charlie I'd come up with a stadium plan to do it right, add north end zone seats over the track to connect to both lower sides with club seats at the top. Then present it to the fans and say as soon as we raise 50% of the costs we'll build it, the rest will be paid by the ticket sales of this area.

No doubt the athletic department needs to put together and actual expansion plan which includes removal of the track. So far all of the expansion projects at KBS have been individual projects that didn't match the previous projects. The illustration released a few years ago was little more than a Photoshop mockup done in house. We need an architect to make a master plan including stages of seating to go from 21,500 we have now to 30,000, and then to 40,000+.

I can see the need for 30,000 seats. But 40,000?

I'd rather see a stadium bursting at the seams with rabid fans than aluminum bleachers shining in the sun.

App State has had great fan support for any program, no doubt. But we would be kidding ourselves if we said there was a legitimate demand for a 40,000 seat stadium. If a school like ECU ever comes up the mountain to play I can see over 40,000 pack KBS regardless of seating capacity.

But we want to double seating capacity when the seats aren't full today at 21,500?

No thanks.

I'm not talking about putting 40,000 seats up next year, but we do need a master plan for the stadium to get to that at some point. We have had over 31,000 people for games against FCS teams that brought maybe 500 fans. If we are playing a good regional FBS team that will actually bring it's own fans then we could easily fill up 35-000 to 40,000 seats. You have to think long term not just 1 or 2 years down the road.

[JTApps1]

Re our new opponents. Talked to someone who should know, and they told me that Michigan may be the 3rd best team on our schedule this yr. They think there are 2 sunbelt teams better than Michigan. I realize it will take alittle time to develop rivalries but the is absolutely ZERO doubt that we did the right thing in moving our football program to schools that are our peers in stadium size, enrollment, and fan support. If the BIG boys want to break away and play semi pro football so be it. We at least will be where we should be with the Sunbelt /Conf USA size programs. We can still play one or two "semi pro " college teams for big paydays and still have a chance for an occasional win. We definitely did the right thing and IMHO in a nick of time. It may take a few years but in 3 yrs. or so everybody will agree that we are were we need to be. It is probably very likely that in 5 yrs. or less that Conf. USA and Sunbelt may re organize into 2 more regional conferences and then we will be exactly were we need to be.

I agree Roach. People say our fans don't know anything about Sun Belt teams, but who knew anything about Wofford, Elon, or Samford before they joined? From what I remember the majority of our fans were very upset when each of those little schools that nobody knew about were added. The school needs to really promote the qualities of the Sun Belt schools leading up to this season. As you say there are some very good teams in this league.

[Appsolutley]

It's not realistic to expect immediate rivalries and intense fan interest in a conference full of schools (sans, Ga. Southern) that we have not played. Rivalries develop over time. Did anybody really think that Furple would end up being one of our best SoCon rivalries?

[NewApp]

Re our new opponents. Talked to someone who should know, and they told me that Michigan may be the 3rd best team on our schedule this yr. They think there are 2 sunbelt teams better than Michigan. I realize it will take alittle time to develop rivalries but the is absolutely ZERO doubt that we did the right thing in moving our football program to schools that are our peers in stadium size, enrollment, and fan support. If the BIG boys want to break away and play semi pro football so be it. We at least will be where we should be with the Sunbelt /Conf USA size programs. We can still play one or two "semi pro " college teams for big paydays and still have a chance for an occasional win. We definitely did the right thing and IMHO in a nick of time. It may take a few years but in 3 yrs. or so everybody will agree that we are were we need to be. It is probably very likely that in 5 yrs. or less that Conf. USA and Sunbelt may re organize into 2 more regional conferences and then we will be exactly were we need to be.

I agree Roach. People say our fans don't know anything about Sun Belt teams, but who knew anything about Wofford, Elon, or Samford before they joined? From what I remember the majority of our fans were very upset when each of those little schools that nobody knew about were added. The school needs to really promote the qualities of the Sun Belt schools leading up to this season. As you say there are some very good teams in this league.

I can't speak to Wofford or Samford, but we Apps played Elon all the way back into the 1930's.

[T-Dog]

I may be in the minority, but I think we can do better than that design. I don't like how the dorm cuts down to the east side and think a third deck on the east side should be on an overhang versus further from the field. The less expensive construction methods used on the east deck may prevent that however.

Perhaps the funds for a new dorm to replace Winkler will be used to fund this type of setup and a parking deck will go where Winkler used to be.

I would like the next plan to have two phases so we are thinking ahead versus just adding seats the easiest way possible.

I hate that design too. It's too hodge podge.

Ideally I'd like the next stadium improvement to make it better looking while making the seats closer. However that'll be up to the big bucks.

[EastHallApp]

People say our fans don't know anything about Sun Belt teams, but who knew anything about Wofford, Elon, or Samford before they joined? From what I remember the majority of our fans were very upset when each of those little schools that nobody knew about were added.

That's true, and I agree that increased familiarity over time will help. But I also don't think fans were really coming to see Wofford or Elon (or Furman or Georgia Southern) all those years. They've been coming to see a championship program that made a big name for itself. App wasn't packing in 30,000 before 2005. That happened because of national championships and beating Michigan.

So, let's be optimistic and assume early success in the Sun Belt. Will the prospect of seeing, say, a 7-5 App team playing an 8-4 Arkansas St. team be enough to drive demand for tickets beyond KBS' current capacity? I hope we find out sooner than later, but my guess is it will take more than that to push attendance much past where it's been. Either bigger-name opponents or huge success (as in, top 25 caliber) for App.

[huskie3]

It's not realistic to expect immediate rivalries and intense fan interest in a conference full of schools (sans, Ga. Southern) that we have not played. Rivalries develop over time. Did anybody really think that Furple would end up being one of our best SoCon rivalries?

We have played Troy we should know them. We have played McNeese, ULL Ragun Cajuns are a lot like them. I don't think we will have any trouble at all establishing rivalries with them. I look forward to travels to Mobile to play South Alabama. The battle for the real ASU will also be a good one. Just because some of the Belt teams aren't household names does not mean the games will not be interesting.

[AppinVA]

People say our fans don't know anything about Sun Belt teams, but who knew anything about Wofford, Elon, or Samford before they joined? From what I remember the majority of our fans were very upset when each of those little schools that nobody knew about were added.

That's true, and I agree that increased familiarity over time will help. But I also don't think fans were really coming to see Wofford or Elon (or Furman or Georgia Southern) all those years. They've been coming to see a championship program that made a big name for itself. App wasn't packing in 30,000 before 2005. That happened because of national championships and beating Michigan.

So, let's be optimistic and assume early success in the Sun Belt. Will the prospect of seeing, say, a 7-5 App team playing an 8-4 Arkansas St. team be enough to drive demand for tickets beyond KBS' current capacity? I hope we find out sooner than later, but my guess is it will take more than that to push attendance much past where it's been. Either bigger-name opponents or huge success (as in, top 25 caliber) for App.

There were two spikes in attendance. The most obvious was after the Michigan victory, but the first one came before the first championship, with the change in athletics administration. The first game in 2005, when we came close to setting an all-time attendance record... for Coastal Carolina... is still one of my all-time App memories. It proved that a good size of App alums and fans were speaking with their feet prior to our (as Appsolutely so eloquently put it) squashing a roach and rooting out a toot.

[T-Dog]

In the 3 Peat years it didn't matter who App played. I remember having 33k for the JMU game, battle of the last two National Champs. The next week was D2 Mars Hill that drew 23k.


However since then and the economy taking a downturn, some games became more equal than others. Games that'll always have big crowds are the home opener, Homecoming and Black Saturday. The other games depend on if there's back to back home games, weather and of course results.

[WVAPPeer]

In the 3 Peat years it didn't matter who App played. I remember having 33k for the JMU game, battle of the last two National Champs. The next week was D2 Mars Hill that drew 23k.


However since then and the economy taking a downturn, some games became more equal than others. Games that'll always have big crowds are the home opener, Homecoming and Black Saturday. The other games depend on if there's back to back home games, weather and of course results.

And Western was always a good crowd ---

[NewApp]

People say our fans don't know anything about Sun Belt teams, but who knew anything about Wofford, Elon, or Samford before they joined? From what I remember the majority of our fans were very upset when each of those little schools that nobody knew about were added.

That's true, and I agree that increased familiarity over time will help. But I also don't think fans were really coming to see Wofford or Elon (or Furman or Georgia Southern) all those years. They've been coming to see a championship program that made a big name for itself. App wasn't packing in 30,000 before 2005. That happened because of national championships and beating Michigan.

So, let's be optimistic and assume early success in the Sun Belt. Will the prospect of seeing, say, a 7-5 App team playing an 8-4 Arkansas St. team be enough to drive demand for tickets beyond KBS' current capacity? I hope we find out sooner than later, but my guess is it will take more than that to push attendance much past where it's been. Either bigger-name opponents or huge success (as in, top 25 caliber) for App.

There were two spikes in attendance. The most obvious was after the Michigan victory, but the first one came before the first championship, with the change in athletics administration. The first game in 2005, when we came close to setting an all-time attendance record... for Coastal Carolina... is still one of my all-time App memories. It proved that a good size of App alums and fans were speaking with their feet prior to our (as Appsolutely so eloquently put it) squashing a roach and rooting out a toot.

A part of the reason for the spike in attendance for the Coastal Carolina game was the tremendous amount of coverage that the Charlotte Observer and the rest of the media gave for the matchup, as the CCU coach (I can't recall his name) spouted off his mouth about how the Chanticleers were going to decimate our Apps on the field.

[Saint3333]

The increase was due to the removal of Laney, and Cobb using common sense to communicate down the mountain and enhance the tailgate experience. And of course excellent weather.

[NewApp]

The increase was due to the removal of Laney, and Cobb using common sense to communicate down the mountain and enhance the tailgate experience. And of course excellent weather.

I know many alumni football fans who didn't even know who Laney or Cobb were.

[WVAPPeer]

The increase was due to the removal of Laney, and Cobb using common sense to communicate down the mountain and enhance the tailgate experience. And of course excellent weather.

I know many alumni football fans who didn't even know who Laney or Cobb were.

You are correct on that newapp - when our daughter was a senior in high school and had been accepted to APP we came up to a couple of football games and soccer matches (my friend's son was a freshman on the soccer team and was a friend of our daughter) - I keep seeing signs, etc., saying "fire Laney" - I asked my friend about it because I didn't know who Laney was and he told me he was the AD but had no idea why people wanted him out ---

I had followed athletics closely and until he was hired at APP I had never heard of Cobb either ---