2014 AppState Prospectus

[firemoose]

My guess is that most FBS programs build their guys up and will usually bring kids in at 280-290. Looking at Va Tech's 2014 class. They signed 5 OL and none of them are over 300 lbs. Clemson signed 3 OL, and only one was over 300. FSU signed 7, 4 under, 3 over. Obviously, college training programs and table can get these kids to the weight they need and keep their athleticism. I would agree we need to get bigger than we have been but I'm not too worried if we aren't recruiting only OL who tip the scales over 300.

Changes already in the works for Strength and Conditioning. Just thought all should know.

[sixtoes9134]

I've heard Steve Logan on the radio here in Raleigh a gazillion times say that when he was at ECU and he couldn't get a 300 lb lineman to give him a 6-5 guy at 260 and he put the weight on him.

[Cincy App]

While we may only have 4 guys over 300 at the moment we have been recruiting more size the last two years. Our O-line will now have 8 players at 6'4 or better with only 1 being 6'4. All of them will weigh 280+ with most of them being young. We also have Edge-Campbell and Collins pushing 300 despite being 6'2 and 6'3. Last week we offered 2 OL for next year that are both over 300 so I don't think it will be long before we are up to par.

I believe you are directly on target. I personally think that weight is significantly over-rated - especially as an incoming freshman. However, your frame is critical. Much more effective to be tall and athletic while able to gain weight than to simply be over 300 pounds entering college. We seem to be improving the height model with our last 2 classes.

[WVAPPeer]

I know it is rare - but - the 13th pick in last night's draft Aaron Donald of Pitt is a 6'0 285 lb. DT - most would say he is too small to play for APP but he will play in the NFL - some things just can't be measured ---

[MDaniels84]

I know it is rare - but - the 13th pick in last night's draft Aaron Donald of Pitt is a 6'0 285 lb. DT - most would say he is too small to play for APP but he will play in the NFL - some things just can't be measured ---

I agree that it is rare for players of that size and position to make it in the NFL. However, remember how many draft analysts and others thought that the Cowboys were crazy for taking Dexter Coakley in the 90's. What you could not measure in Dex's height and weight was quickly replaced with sheer speed and work ethic. I love to see that when it happens.

[Maddog1956]

I know it is rare - but - the 13th pick in last night's draft Aaron Donald of Pitt is a 6'0 285 lb. DT - most would say he is too small to play for APP but he will play in the NFL - some things just can't be measured ---

I agree that it is rare for players of that size and position to make it in the NFL. However, remember how many draft analysts and others thought that the Cowboys were crazy for taking Dexter Coakley in the 90's. What you could not measure in Dex's height and weight was quickly replaced with sheer speed and work ethic. I love to see that when it happens.

That's why I hate hearing that a QB is too short

[ASUPATCH]

I know it is rare - but - the 13th pick in last night's draft Aaron Donald of Pitt is a 6'0 285 lb. DT - most would say he is too small to play for APP but he will play in the NFL - some things just can't be measured ---

I agree that it is rare for players of that size and position to make it in the NFL. However, remember how many draft analysts and others thought that the Cowboys were crazy for taking Dexter Coakley in the 90's. What you could not measure in Dex's height and weight was quickly replaced with sheer speed and work ethic. I love to see that when it happens.

That's why I hate hearing that a QB is too short

There are exceptions to every rule. Drew Brees, Barry Sanders, Steve Smith, Russell Wilson, Doug Flutie even Warren Sapp was undersized at barely 6 feet tall. Many have been able to over achieve but given the same set of talent and heart you take the guy with the measurables.

[Maddog1956]

I know it is rare - but - the 13th pick in last night's draft Aaron Donald of Pitt is a 6'0 285 lb. DT - most would say he is too small to play for APP but he will play in the NFL - some things just can't be measured ---

I agree that it is rare for players of that size and position to make it in the NFL. However, remember how many draft analysts and others thought that the Cowboys were crazy for taking Dexter Coakley in the 90's. What you could not measure in Dex's height and weight was quickly replaced with sheer speed and work ethic. I love to see that when it happens.

That's why I hate hearing that a QB is too short

There are exceptions to every rule. Drew Brees, Barry Sanders, Steve Smith, Russell Wilson, Doug Flutie even Warren Sapp was undersized at barely 6 feet tall. Many have been able to over achieve but given the same set of talent and heart you take the guy with the measurables.

I agree it's hard to measure the unmeasurable (joke) but that's what makes winners instead of average teams. Steve Smith came as a kick returner, Brees couldn't find a job. But I understand the logic behind playing the numbers.

I just remember teams trying out players during the baseball strike and the first "test" was how fast they could cross first. If they didn't make it under a certain time they left the field, if they did they stayed. (i understand you can't teach speed)

There is just so much talent out there and it's the exception that going to keep you winning with low draft picks and salary caps.

Look a Birdman on the Heat, he was month to month at one time (and a steal), and it might be a little strong, but I don't know if they would have won the NC without him. Someone saw something that was a fit with the Heat.

That doesn't mean I don't think we should have bigger guys in some positions. I think at the FCS level speed and athletic ability might have trumped size because most of the really big and strong and fast guys were going FBS anyway. At the FBS level I think it's going to be more of a balancing act, until we learn how best to use the recruits we get.

[EastHallApp]

I think at the FCS level speed and athletic ability might have trumped size because most of the really big and strong and fast guys were going FBS anyway. At the FBS level I think it's going to be more of a balancing act, until we learn how best to use the recruits we get.

I would take that thought a step further and say that FBS emphasizes speed much more than bulk. It's been moving that way for at least 20 years, and especially the last 10 or so. College football is about finding offensive players who can spread the field and make people miss, and defensive players who can cover and tackle in space.

Obviously if you are choosing between two linebackers with otherwise equal skill and athleticism, you're probably going to take the 6'3, 245 guy over the 6'0", 220 guy. But there's a reason they call those guys "freak" athletes - there aren't many around, and they tend to gravitate toward elite programs.

The way nontraditional programs have leveled the playing field over the past 10-15 years is with speed (including the WVU/RichRod offense that App was modeled on). Obviously we'll have bigger players than we did in FCS, but I don't expect to see us sending out too many 250 lb. linebackers or 230 lb. running backs any time soon.

[EastHallApp]

As an example of the size/speed point, here's Florida State's depth chart from last season:

http://www.seminoles.com/sports/m-footb ... chart.html

The offensive line is big - all starters 300 lbs. or more, with all but the center between 315-330.

However, the starting linebackers are 215, 218, 235.

They do have a couple of bigger running backs (they are Florida State, after all), but their starter was 5'9", 203.

They had one huge WR in Kelvin Benjamin and one 6'2" reserve; the other four guys on the 2-deep are all 6'0" and under, 180 and under.

Their five DBs listed as starters were all 200 lbs. or less.

All four DTs on the 2-deep are under 300 lbs.

[EastHallApp]

For an even more relevant comparison (due to their style of play and at least slightly less ubiquitous recruiting presence), check out Oregon:

http://www.goducks.com/pdf9/2527601.pdf

- Four of five starting OL under 300 lbs.

- Every WR in the 2-deep under 200 lbs.

- RBs 5'9" 171, 5'10" 201.

- 4 of 5 DTs under 300 lbs.

- Heaviest LB is 232.

- 6 of 8 DBs under 6'0". 7 of 8 weigh less than 200.

[WVAPPeer]

I think at the FCS level speed and athletic ability might have trumped size because most of the really big and strong and fast guys were going FBS anyway. At the FBS level I think it's going to be more of a balancing act, until we learn how best to use the recruits we get.

I would take that thought a step further and say that FBS emphasizes speed much more than bulk. It's been moving that way for at least 20 years, and especially the last 10 or so. College football is about finding offensive players who can spread the field and make people miss, and defensive players who can cover and tackle in space.

Obviously if you are choosing between two linebackers with otherwise equal skill and athleticism, you're probably going to take the 6'3, 245 guy over the 6'0", 220 guy. But there's a reason they call those guys "freak" athletes - there aren't many around, and they tend to gravitate toward elite programs.

The way nontraditional programs have leveled the playing field over the past 10-15 years is with speed (including the WVU/RichRod offense that App was modeled on). Obviously we'll have bigger players than we did in FCS, but I don't expect to see us sending out too many 250 lb. linebackers or 230 lb. running backs any time soon.

You are right about RichRod - one of the very first things he said when he took over was something to the effect of "We've got to get rid of these big fat linemen" ---

[ASUPATCH]

I think at the FCS level speed and athletic ability might have trumped size because most of the really big and strong and fast guys were going FBS anyway. At the FBS level I think it's going to be more of a balancing act, until we learn how best to use the recruits we get.

I would take that thought a step further and say that FBS emphasizes speed much more than bulk. It's been moving that way for at least 20 years, and especially the last 10 or so. College football is about finding offensive players who can spread the field and make people miss, and defensive players who can cover and tackle in space.

Obviously if you are choosing between two linebackers with otherwise equal skill and athleticism, you're probably going to take the 6'3, 245 guy over the 6'0", 220 guy. But there's a reason they call those guys "freak" athletes - there aren't many around, and they tend to gravitate toward elite programs.

The way nontraditional programs have leveled the playing field over the past 10-15 years is with speed (including the WVU/RichRod offense that App was modeled on). Obviously we'll have bigger players than we did in FCS, but I don't expect to see us sending out too many 250 lb. linebackers or 230 lb. running backs any time soon.

You are right about RichRod - one of the very first things he said when he took over was something to the effect of "We've got to get rid of these big fat linemen" ---

I understand his thinking but..........LLoyd Cars Tenure at UM>>>>RROD at UM

[Maddog1956]

As an example of the size/speed point, here's Florida State's depth chart from last season:

They had one huge WR in Kelvin Benjamin and one 6'2" reserve; the other four guys on the 2-deep are all 6'0" and under, 180 and under.

And now the Panthers have him.

[lillycafe]

My guess is that most FBS programs build their guys up and will usually bring kids in at 280-290. Looking at Va Tech's 2014 class. They signed 5 OL and none of them are over 300 lbs. Clemson signed 3 OL, and only one was over 300. FSU signed 7, 4 under, 3 over. Obviously, college training programs and table can get these kids to the weight they need and keep their athleticism. I would agree we need to get bigger than we have been but I'm not too worried if we aren't recruiting only OL who tip the scales over 300.

Changes already in the works for Strength and Conditioning. Just thought all should know.

I see on appstatesports.com it is listed as TBA.