The cancer on this program is

[AppinVA]

Remember, all this, umm, knowledge comes from a guy who thinks it was a dark day for our University when Uncle Ken squashed the Roach.

[appdaze]

Guys and Gals, stop feeding this jackass troll. We all know that FBS and FCS are both Division one and anyone can easily look it up straight on the NCAA website to see that those are indeed the facts. This guy is just being an ass as usual. I'm sure he is well aware of the truth as well. Its pathetic that he spends his time and energy trying to belittle fellow App fans to make his own ego happy. I still stand by my earlier description in the now-deleted thread. It keeps getting proven true day after day. Just don't reply to him anymore.

[AppStFan1]

If Clark is removed and I have my doubts.
App should hire the best available offensive minded coach who is looking to make a splash at App and then move on to bigger jobs.

The best coaches won’t stay at App long term, forget it.

So, find the best coach and then another one when he leaves.

I know it sucks, but that’s reality.

I think we need to go for a G5 coordinator who has been a small school HC or a FCS HC that has CEO qualities to them. I think Shawn is a good coach but lacks CEO qualities and we need someone who can do that. We could add resources to help take that part of it away from a coach like Shawn but that requires way more money. For what we have we need to get a good FCS HC that has good support staff and assistant coaches around them but he has the CEO qualities you now need in a head coach.

I don't think it sucks to have to hire a new coach every few years. That means we are winning. Jerry Moore would not have stayed as long as he did if he came along now. This is just a different world so we have to realize that we can't expect that with every coach.

[bcoach]

jmu absolutly is. I have no idea about TxSt but jmu is.

JMU has more money on b/c they take larger athletic fees from their students. This is not allowed at the FBS level and JMU is in the process of reducing the amount they charge students. Its a phased reduction. I don't remember the figures but when you adjust their budget to not include the elevated student fees their atheltic budget is on par with the rest of the Sun Belt.

If someone with more knowledge on this topic would like to correct me then please do.

https://www.sportico.com/leagues/colleg ... 234771980/

had no idea but that's wild. Highest student fees of any school in the country.. Honestly, I've always said App needs to do this. I know it's unpopular but as a student, I gladly would have paid double whatever fee we had for us to compete. It's good for the schools image for sports to be good and attracts better students as well so go for it, Doug. It's kind of the only choice we have going forward. If only more of the living alumni donated as well then that would help too. In fairness, I don't know how to convince more people to give their money away but still. Even just $100 for 1/4 of the living alumni would go along way.

It is not the responsibility of the STUDENTS to pay for athletics in this way. Rather ticket sales (which should be increased with an NIL ear mark like Tennessee did), sponsorship, donations and internal revenue (TV, concessions, apparel, licensing agreements).

I believe we should do the following
1. Increase ticket prices & add an NIL fee to each ticket.
2. Increase messaging on all platforms that giving to YC, even a little, is important. Get former athletes to shoot video spots and post on social media. We have an incredible video team, get them involved.
3. Fund the YC so it can raise money effectively. Ask any alumni less than 40 if they EVER get asked for money directly...they haven't
4. Expand licensing agreements so the brand it's self can make money.

That’s your opinion but I believe the students should be funding a good portion, especially when we know damn well a small mountain town isn’t going to draw massive brand exposure like a university in a major city. Asking alumni to ALWAYS fund everything is crazier. I don’t understand why more alumni don’t donate but that’s not likely to change without a creative campaign so make the kids put up $2,000 year (they pay $783 now but it should be even higher if they’re from out of state) It’s only 4 years of that compared to a lifetime of relying on alumni for everything.

There is a lot of that in this country. You want someone else to pay for your entertainment. Well MY opinion is that those who want that entertainmentn should pay. Why should someone who has no interest in sports or football in particular be bound to pay for our entertainment.

[Pikapp79]

JMU has more money on b/c they take larger athletic fees from their students. This is not allowed at the FBS level and JMU is in the process of reducing the amount they charge students. Its a phased reduction. I don't remember the figures but when you adjust their budget to not include the elevated student fees their atheltic budget is on par with the rest of the Sun Belt.

If someone with more knowledge on this topic would like to correct me then please do.

https://www.sportico.com/leagues/colleg ... 234771980/

had no idea but that's wild. Highest student fees of any school in the country.. Honestly, I've always said App needs to do this. I know it's unpopular but as a student, I gladly would have paid double whatever fee we had for us to compete. It's good for the schools image for sports to be good and attracts better students as well so go for it, Doug. It's kind of the only choice we have going forward. If only more of the living alumni donated as well then that would help too. In fairness, I don't know how to convince more people to give their money away but still. Even just $100 for 1/4 of the living alumni would go along way.

It is not the responsibility of the STUDENTS to pay for athletics in this way. Rather ticket sales (which should be increased with an NIL ear mark like Tennessee did), sponsorship, donations and internal revenue (TV, concessions, apparel, licensing agreements).

I believe we should do the following
1. Increase ticket prices & add an NIL fee to each ticket.
2. Increase messaging on all platforms that giving to YC, even a little, is important. Get former athletes to shoot video spots and post on social media. We have an incredible video team, get them involved.
3. Fund the YC so it can raise money effectively. Ask any alumni less than 40 if they EVER get asked for money directly...they haven't
4. Expand licensing agreements so the brand it's self can make money.

Add anything connected with NIL to ticket price or Yosef Club and I save a lot of money. Not paying a dime to pay a player. I realize schools paying players is coming and that’s when I’m out.

Why?

It’s not a fans responsibility to pay a college player. If they can make it through corporate sponsorship so be it. You don’t write a personal check to an NFL player why should you for a professional college player.

[bcoach]

Nice level headed post. It’s just not worked out.

The people that think that Marshall or south Alabama have some nil slush fund are completely wrong.

I agree with you both. Marshall is same boat as us, they aren't good either. I was thinking more JMU, Boise or even a TxSt coming from nowhere on the NIL part. There are G5 that will be showing up as we backslide due to lack of $$.

JMU and TxSt are not bigger NIL hitters than us.

jmu absolutly is. I have no idea about TxSt but jmu is.

JMU has more money on b/c they take larger athletic fees from their students. This is not allowed at the FBS level and JMU is in the process of reducing the amount they charge students. Its a phased reduction. I don't remember the figures but when you adjust their budget to not include the elevated student fees their atheltic budget is on par with the rest of the Sun Belt.

If someone with more knowledge on this topic would like to correct me then please do.

I can be corrected but I don't believe that reduction is due to becoming FBS. Virginia passed a law around 2015 or so that capped what could be charged. But with that said my comment was in refrence to NIL and they have a bunch.

[WASU 93]

https://www.sportico.com/leagues/colleg ... 234771980/

had no idea but that's wild. Highest student fees of any school in the country.. Honestly, I've always said App needs to do this. I know it's unpopular but as a student, I gladly would have paid double whatever fee we had for us to compete. It's good for the schools image for sports to be good and attracts better students as well so go for it, Doug. It's kind of the only choice we have going forward. If only more of the living alumni donated as well then that would help too. In fairness, I don't know how to convince more people to give their money away but still. Even just $100 for 1/4 of the living alumni would go along way.

It is not the responsibility of the STUDENTS to pay for athletics in this way. Rather ticket sales (which should be increased with an NIL ear mark like Tennessee did), sponsorship, donations and internal revenue (TV, concessions, apparel, licensing agreements).

I believe we should do the following
1. Increase ticket prices & add an NIL fee to each ticket.
2. Increase messaging on all platforms that giving to YC, even a little, is important. Get former athletes to shoot video spots and post on social media. We have an incredible video team, get them involved.
3. Fund the YC so it can raise money effectively. Ask any alumni less than 40 if they EVER get asked for money directly...they haven't
4. Expand licensing agreements so the brand it's self can make money.

Add anything connected with NIL to ticket price or Yosef Club and I save a lot of money. Not paying a dime to pay a player. I realize schools paying players is coming and that’s when I’m out.

Why?

It’s not a fans responsibility to pay a college player. If they can make it through corporate sponsorship so be it. You don’t write a personal check to an NFL player why should you for a professional college player.

I agree 100% with this take.

It's one thing to help pay for their scholarships to help them get a degree while they are playing for the school you love. It's also not a bad thing to help pay for facilities, amenities, training gear, weight rooms, etc. But to just outright pay a salary is something that crosses the line.

[Howard Street Hooligan]

JMU has more money on b/c they take larger athletic fees from their students. This is not allowed at the FBS level and JMU is in the process of reducing the amount they charge students. Its a phased reduction. I don't remember the figures but when you adjust their budget to not include the elevated student fees their atheltic budget is on par with the rest of the Sun Belt.

If someone with more knowledge on this topic would like to correct me then please do.

https://www.sportico.com/leagues/colleg ... 234771980/

had no idea but that's wild. Highest student fees of any school in the country.. Honestly, I've always said App needs to do this. I know it's unpopular but as a student, I gladly would have paid double whatever fee we had for us to compete. It's good for the schools image for sports to be good and attracts better students as well so go for it, Doug. It's kind of the only choice we have going forward. If only more of the living alumni donated as well then that would help too. In fairness, I don't know how to convince more people to give their money away but still. Even just $100 for 1/4 of the living alumni would go along way.

It is not the responsibility of the STUDENTS to pay for athletics in this way. Rather ticket sales (which should be increased with an NIL ear mark like Tennessee did), sponsorship, donations and internal revenue (TV, concessions, apparel, licensing agreements).

I believe we should do the following
1. Increase ticket prices & add an NIL fee to each ticket.
2. Increase messaging on all platforms that giving to YC, even a little, is important. Get former athletes to shoot video spots and post on social media. We have an incredible video team, get them involved.
3. Fund the YC so it can raise money effectively. Ask any alumni less than 40 if they EVER get asked for money directly...they haven't
4. Expand licensing agreements so the brand it's self can make money.

That’s your opinion but I believe the students should be funding a good portion, especially when we know damn well a small mountain town isn’t going to draw massive brand exposure like a university in a major city. Asking alumni to ALWAYS fund everything is crazier. I don’t understand why more alumni don’t donate but that’s not likely to change without a creative campaign so make the kids put up $2,000 year (they pay $783 now but it should be even higher if they’re from out of state) It’s only 4 years of that compared to a lifetime of relying on alumni for everything.

There is a lot of that in this country. You want someone else to pay for your entertainment. Well MY opinion is that those who want that entertainmentn should pay. Why should someone who has no interest in sports or football in particular be bound to pay for our entertainment.

Because it’s your duty as a student to help fund athletics (I don’t mean NIL payments to players) and the school as a whole. Most students are only there because of the notoriety the school received because of football wins. It improved everything from new buildings and better students. Personally, I’d rather the school use funds elsewhere but they’re not taking endowment dollars to improve athletics, so the students should fall in line next. Alumni SHOULD donate more but that’s another discussion.

[appst89]

Be a man and mention me, And it's 1-AA. FCS is not the same as FBS, scholarships limits are different. Know the ins and outs before you debate me.

FBS
P5
G5
FCS or 1-AA Scholarships are less than FBS.
D2
D3
NAIA
Junior College
High School
and then Watooga HS

I like your points but your two degrees didn't teach you everything.

FBS and FCS are both Division 1. Perhaps you should know that before you call out others. If a school sponsors football, it has to be D1 in order for their basketball program to be D1, thus FCS is considered D1 football. Everyone knows the scholarship numbers are different, but that wasn't the debate. The debate was D1, and you were wrong. You should apologize.

1-AA FCS and FBS are two separate entities....

Basketball is (ALL 363 or 364) play for 1 NATIONAL TITLE!!!!

FBS has a college playoff system and Bowl games 134 teams - CBSsports.com ranks them weekly actually a good read

FCS or 1-AA has a 16 or 32 team playoff. -- no one cares about this really anymore.

Learns college athletic sports before entering into the unknown with the DOTE.

And they are still both D1.

And you're still wrong, and not just wrong, but belligerently wrong. Thanks for the laugh during this tough time.

Both can't be D 1 it defeats the purpose. Only one can be D1... I'll let you and 95/97 tell me which is D1

You got 24 hours to decide.

I don’t need to decide. I already know and I told you. It’s up to you if you want to continue to be wrong.

And yes, I know he’s just being a troll, but sometimes it’s just got to be done.

[Yosef84]

FBS and FCS are both Division 1. Perhaps you should know that before you call out others. If a school sponsors football, it has to be D1 in order for their basketball program to be D1, thus FCS is considered D1 football. Everyone knows the scholarship numbers are different, but that wasn't the debate. The debate was D1, and you were wrong. You should apologize.

1-AA FCS and FBS are two separate entities....

Basketball is (ALL 363 or 364) play for 1 NATIONAL TITLE!!!!

FBS has a college playoff system and Bowl games 134 teams - CBSsports.com ranks them weekly actually a good read

FCS or 1-AA has a 16 or 32 team playoff. -- no one cares about this really anymore.

Learns college athletic sports before entering into the unknown with the DOTE.

DOTE, please stop your ridiculous BS. Div I football has two SUBDIVISIONS. YOU don't get to decide that. It's a fact and you can ask the NCAA if you want to. Better yet, check out championship trophies from 2006 and 2007. They both read "NCAA Division I Football Champion". They don't even mention FCS because the BCS was not affiliated with the NCAA...this was the only Div I championship actually controlled by the FCS. It's not rocket science, and trying to impose your personal opinion is just pathetic.

89, sorry for replying to your post and addressing DOTE.


And they are still both D1.

And you're still wrong, and not just wrong, but belligerently wrong. Thanks for the laugh during this tough time.

Both can't be D 1 it defeats the purpose. Only one can be D1... I'll let you and 95/97 tell me which is D1

You got 24 hours to decide.

I don’t need to decide. I already know and I told you. It’s up to you if you want to continue to be wrong.

And yes, I know he’s just being a troll, but sometimes it’s just got to be done.

[bcoach]

https://www.sportico.com/leagues/colleg ... 234771980/

had no idea but that's wild. Highest student fees of any school in the country.. Honestly, I've always said App needs to do this. I know it's unpopular but as a student, I gladly would have paid double whatever fee we had for us to compete. It's good for the schools image for sports to be good and attracts better students as well so go for it, Doug. It's kind of the only choice we have going forward. If only more of the living alumni donated as well then that would help too. In fairness, I don't know how to convince more people to give their money away but still. Even just $100 for 1/4 of the living alumni would go along way.

It is not the responsibility of the STUDENTS to pay for athletics in this way. Rather ticket sales (which should be increased with an NIL ear mark like Tennessee did), sponsorship, donations and internal revenue (TV, concessions, apparel, licensing agreements).

I believe we should do the following
1. Increase ticket prices & add an NIL fee to each ticket.
2. Increase messaging on all platforms that giving to YC, even a little, is important. Get former athletes to shoot video spots and post on social media. We have an incredible video team, get them involved.
3. Fund the YC so it can raise money effectively. Ask any alumni less than 40 if they EVER get asked for money directly...they haven't
4. Expand licensing agreements so the brand it's self can make money.

That’s your opinion but I believe the students should be funding a good portion, especially when we know damn well a small mountain town isn’t going to draw massive brand exposure like a university in a major city. Asking alumni to ALWAYS fund everything is crazier. I don’t understand why more alumni don’t donate but that’s not likely to change without a creative campaign so make the kids put up $2,000 year (they pay $783 now but it should be even higher if they’re from out of state) It’s only 4 years of that compared to a lifetime of relying on alumni for everything.

There is a lot of that in this country. You want someone else to pay for your entertainment. Well MY opinion is that those who want that entertainmentn should pay. Why should someone who has no interest in sports or football in particular be bound to pay for our entertainment.

Because it’s your duty as a student to help fund athletics (I don’t mean NIL payments to players) and the school as a whole. Most students are only there because of the notoriety the school received because of football wins. It improved everything from new buildings and better students. Personally, I’d rather the school use funds elsewhere but they’re not taking endowment dollars to improve athletics, so the students should fall in line next. Alumni SHOULD donate more but that’s another discussion.

Your duty as a student? Really? Most students are only there because of football wins? Has it helped with enrolment? Sure it has but you are taking it way over the top.

[kornegaylw]

https://www.sportico.com/leagues/colleg ... 234771980/

had no idea but that's wild. Highest student fees of any school in the country.. Honestly, I've always said App needs to do this. I know it's unpopular but as a student, I gladly would have paid double whatever fee we had for us to compete. It's good for the schools image for sports to be good and attracts better students as well so go for it, Doug. It's kind of the only choice we have going forward. If only more of the living alumni donated as well then that would help too. In fairness, I don't know how to convince more people to give their money away but still. Even just $100 for 1/4 of the living alumni would go along way.

It is not the responsibility of the STUDENTS to pay for athletics in this way. Rather ticket sales (which should be increased with an NIL ear mark like Tennessee did), sponsorship, donations and internal revenue (TV, concessions, apparel, licensing agreements).

I believe we should do the following
1. Increase ticket prices & add an NIL fee to each ticket.
2. Increase messaging on all platforms that giving to YC, even a little, is important. Get former athletes to shoot video spots and post on social media. We have an incredible video team, get them involved.
3. Fund the YC so it can raise money effectively. Ask any alumni less than 40 if they EVER get asked for money directly...they haven't
4. Expand licensing agreements so the brand it's self can make money.

That’s your opinion but I believe the students should be funding a good portion, especially when we know damn well a small mountain town isn’t going to draw massive brand exposure like a university in a major city. Asking alumni to ALWAYS fund everything is crazier. I don’t understand why more alumni don’t donate but that’s not likely to change without a creative campaign so make the kids put up $2,000 year (they pay $783 now but it should be even higher if they’re from out of state) It’s only 4 years of that compared to a lifetime of relying on alumni for everything.

There is a lot of that in this country. You want someone else to pay for your entertainment. Well MY opinion is that those who want that entertainmentn should pay. Why should someone who has no interest in sports or football in particular be bound to pay for our entertainment.

Because it’s your duty as a student to help fund athletics (I don’t mean NIL payments to players) and the school as a whole. Most students are only there because of the notoriety the school received because of football wins. It improved everything from new buildings and better students. Personally, I’d rather the school use funds elsewhere but they’re not taking endowment dollars to improve athletics, so the students should fall in line next. Alumni SHOULD donate more but that’s another discussion.

A student has no "duty" lol...they aren't a solider. Yes athletic success has increased the University's notoriety but it's not the responsibility of the student to fund something that is arguably superfluous.

If you're watching the games and on this blog you're invested personally in the success of the program. Why wouldn't you put your money where you mouth is to see it succeed? If you don't then what right do you have to complain?

[BambooRdApp]

It should be a combination of both. Students get benefits from the sports programs. They get in "free" ...but their student fees are really paying for the "free" I guess...with that said, I think the non-student fans should pay the significant majority of the costs.
It will be interesting to see how JMU transforms as student fees decrease. With that said, the changing landscape may allow JMU and others to continue to foot some of bill at current rate as legislation evolves which I believe it will. If it does, then it will be interesting if other schools in SBC charge more under whatever program/term they want to use..
All schools...but especially the good ones, in revenue producing sports like basketball and football, know that they are very important to the overall university...whether it should be or not. In App's case, the success of the football program and GameDay experience has been one of the critical factors for the growth of the university.

[ericsaid]

It takes money to make money. And we don't have it.

App has the most valuable brand in the Sun Belt by $30 million. Apparently App’s football brand value is $125 million and the next closest is Marshall at $80 million.

App either needs to leverage that in the Sun Belt or needs to leave the Sun Belt and see if the AAC is a possibility, while arguing for a full share in pay.

I can also tell you that South Alabama and Marshall are not paying more money than App State is. NIL existed in 2022 when Notre Dame and Texas A&M fell. It exists this year where Vanderbilt took Missouri to OT and just beat Alabama.


The issue isn’t money. The issue right now, as far as I can tell, is a confluence of issues with injuries and head coaching deficiencies.

I am all in favor of bringing in Tre Lamb or seeing what Ponce could do leading a program. Someone argued that “we don’t need someone learning on the job” in regards to Tre Lamb but that is exactly what Satterfield, Drinkwitz, and Clark have done. Lamb would be the first head coach with actual Head Coaching experience that App has brought in since the 80’s.


Football is changing and App, predictably, has not really evolved beyond what was going on in 2018. The defense is the same, the offensive scheme is more of an air raid but it is very straight forward. Sloan has continued the slide we saw under Dale Jones and it has hit rock bottom now. The worst since what, 2002?

Time to see if you can go after someone who has been successful everywhere they have been.

Fair points, but would you please provide references on how these numbers were determined? Very interesting valuations, sir. Thanks!

Someone on the Sun Belt board posted the valuations. Not sure where they got them from but I don't have reason to doubt them.

[ericsaid]

It takes money to make money. And we don't have it.

App has the most valuable brand in the Sun Belt by $30 million. Apparently App’s football brand value is $125 million and the next closest is Marshall at $80 million.

App either needs to leverage that in the Sun Belt or needs to leave the Sun Belt and see if the AAC is a possibility, while arguing for a full share in pay.

I can also tell you that South Alabama and Marshall are not paying more money than App State is. NIL existed in 2022 when Notre Dame and Texas A&M fell. It exists this year where Vanderbilt took Missouri to OT and just beat Alabama.


The issue isn’t money. The issue right now, as far as I can tell, is a confluence of issues with injuries and head coaching deficiencies.

I am all in favor of bringing in Tre Lamb or seeing what Ponce could do leading a program. Someone argued that “we don’t need someone learning on the job” in regards to Tre Lamb but that is exactly what Satterfield, Drinkwitz, and Clark have done. Lamb would be the first head coach with actual Head Coaching experience that App has brought in since the 80’s.


Football is changing and App, predictably, has not really evolved beyond what was going on in 2018. The defense is the same, the offensive scheme is more of an air raid but it is very straight forward. Sloan has continued the slide we saw under Dale Jones and it has hit rock bottom now. The worst since what, 2002?

Time to see if you can go after someone who has been successful everywhere they have been.

How is " brand value" determined?

I would assume it is the valuation determined by viewership, marketing, sales, etc. Look at game viewership when App is on linear, look at attendance, look at licensable merchandise sales, etc.

Someone on the Sun Belt board posted these numbers and there are at least three people with close ties to programs, including one play by play guy, who posts there I believe. He is very in tune with the media landscape, payouts, etc.

Regardless, if those numbers are accurate, it isn't exactly a nothingburger that programs like ULM, USA, Troy, Georgia Southern, Georgia State, and Coastal get the same media share as App does. Boise pushed for a larger share of their conference revenue because they were a cash cow for the conference.

Now the Sun Belt would be fine without App, but what would the perception be if App, JMU, and Marshall left? Personally, I feel like App, JMU, Marshall, and Louisiana would be ideal revenue enhancements for the AAC, particularly if you could get full shares of revenue and not a fraction like the new AAC programs took.

App has, in effect, taken a moribund conference in 2013, and along with Georgia Southern initially, Coastal for a couple years, and JMU now, lifted the perception and national performance through competition alone. Yet instead of cementing that status, the leadership has sat idly by and done nothing, demanded nothing, and explored nothing.

The "aw shucks" faction of this university kills me. "We're just little ol' App State". Well, "Little ol' App State's" football program is worth more than the combined brand value of every other Sun Belt programs revenue producing sports. This is why the AAC came knocking the last go round, and App said no, we won't up our budget. I'm guessing the AAC asked App to take a partial share in revenue payouts but that could have been a point of negotiation. If it's really about money, then the leadership of the program needs to take it's leverage and put it to use.

[ericsaid]

It takes money to make money. And we don't have it.

App has the most valuable brand in the Sun Belt by $30 million. Apparently App’s football brand value is $125 million and the next closest is Marshall at $80 million.

App either needs to leverage that in the Sun Belt or needs to leave the Sun Belt and see if the AAC is a possibility, while arguing for a full share in pay.

I can also tell you that South Alabama and Marshall are not paying more money than App State is. NIL existed in 2022 when Notre Dame and Texas A&M fell. It exists this year where Vanderbilt took Missouri to OT and just beat Alabama.


The issue isn’t money. The issue right now, as far as I can tell, is a confluence of issues with injuries and head coaching deficiencies.

I am all in favor of bringing in Tre Lamb or seeing what Ponce could do leading a program. Someone argued that “we don’t need someone learning on the job” in regards to Tre Lamb but that is exactly what Satterfield, Drinkwitz, and Clark have done. Lamb would be the first head coach with actual Head Coaching experience that App has brought in since the 80’s.


Football is changing and App, predictably, has not really evolved beyond what was going on in 2018. The defense is the same, the offensive scheme is more of an air raid but it is very straight forward. Sloan has continued the slide we saw under Dale Jones and it has hit rock bottom now. The worst since what, 2002?

Time to see if you can go after someone who has been successful everywhere they have been.

I’ve talked to a few ex players that wanted Tre Lamb to get a look back in 2020. Granted, most of those I know played with Taylor Lamb, so there might be some bias there. Lamb didn’t help himself yesterday losing to UTchat.

ETSU was something like 2-10 last year? They played App close, they should have beat NDSU. He is a program builder while being an excellent offensive coach. Give him the resources that App State has access to and let him go. He is probably the closest thing to Satterfield you could get an his opinion of App State is already very high. The ability to take someone who is intimately familiar with the program through his family and proximity, is almost as good as having someone who has been a part of it.

[bcoach]

It takes money to make money. And we don't have it.

App has the most valuable brand in the Sun Belt by $30 million. Apparently App’s football brand value is $125 million and the next closest is Marshall at $80 million.

App either needs to leverage that in the Sun Belt or needs to leave the Sun Belt and see if the AAC is a possibility, while arguing for a full share in pay.

I can also tell you that South Alabama and Marshall are not paying more money than App State is. NIL existed in 2022 when Notre Dame and Texas A&M fell. It exists this year where Vanderbilt took Missouri to OT and just beat Alabama.


The issue isn’t money. The issue right now, as far as I can tell, is a confluence of issues with injuries and head coaching deficiencies.

I am all in favor of bringing in Tre Lamb or seeing what Ponce could do leading a program. Someone argued that “we don’t need someone learning on the job” in regards to Tre Lamb but that is exactly what Satterfield, Drinkwitz, and Clark have done. Lamb would be the first head coach with actual Head Coaching experience that App has brought in since the 80’s.


Football is changing and App, predictably, has not really evolved beyond what was going on in 2018. The defense is the same, the offensive scheme is more of an air raid but it is very straight forward. Sloan has continued the slide we saw under Dale Jones and it has hit rock bottom now. The worst since what, 2002?

Time to see if you can go after someone who has been successful everywhere they have been.

How is " brand value" determined?

I would assume it is the valuation determined by viewership, marketing, sales, etc. Look at game viewership when App is on linear, look at attendance, look at licensable merchandise sales, etc.

Someone on the Sun Belt board posted these numbers and there are at least three people with close ties to programs, including one play by play guy, who posts there I believe. He is very in tune with the media landscape, payouts, etc.

Regardless, if those numbers are accurate, it isn't exactly a nothingburger that programs like ULM, USA, Troy, Georgia Southern, Georgia State, and Coastal get the same media share as App does. Boise pushed for a larger share of their conference revenue because they were a cash cow for the conference.

Now the Sun Belt would be fine without App, but what would the perception be if App, JMU, and Marshall left? Personally, I feel like App, JMU, Marshall, and Louisiana would be ideal revenue enhancements for the AAC, particularly if you could get full shares of revenue and not a fraction like the new AAC programs took.

App has, in effect, taken a moribund conference in 2013, and along with Georgia Southern initially, Coastal for a couple years, and JMU now, lifted the perception and national performance through competition alone. Yet instead of cementing that status, the leadership has sat idly by and done nothing, demanded nothing, and explored nothing.

The "aw shucks" faction of this university kills me. "We're just little ol' App State". Well, "Little ol' App State's" football program is worth more than the combined brand value of every other Sun Belt programs revenue producing sports. This is why the AAC came knocking the last go round, and App said no, we won't up our budget. I'm guessing the AAC asked App to take a partial share in revenue payouts but that could have been a point of negotiation. If it's really about money, then the leadership of the program needs to take it's leverage and put it to use.

What I am hearing is we really don't know where the numbers come from or how we benifit from them. So we take them and come up with asumptions.

[Howard Street Hooligan]

Again, the STUDENT should pay more than they’re currently paying but ALUMNI should as well. If you’re going to go to the school then sorry, a few thousand should go towards athletics a year. Our alumni don’t give money and I don’t see that changing so students, it’s on you while your at school. Maybe it encourage them to KEEP giving down the road. Idk. The school should invest more of its own dollars too.

I donate but we have very little fans compared to big schools so EVERYONE needs to chip in and that includes the students while they’re in school. Bump it up, DG.

It is not the responsibility of the STUDENTS to pay for athletics in this way. Rather ticket sales (which should be increased with an NIL ear mark like Tennessee did), sponsorship, donations and internal revenue (TV, concessions, apparel, licensing agreements).

I believe we should do the following
1. Increase ticket prices & add an NIL fee to each ticket.
2. Increase messaging on all platforms that giving to YC, even a little, is important. Get former athletes to shoot video spots and post on social media. We have an incredible video team, get them involved.
3. Fund the YC so it can raise money effectively. Ask any alumni less than 40 if they EVER get asked for money directly...they haven't
4. Expand licensing agreements so the brand it's self can make money.

That’s your opinion but I believe the students should be funding a good portion, especially when we know damn well a small mountain town isn’t going to draw massive brand exposure like a university in a major city. Asking alumni to ALWAYS fund everything is crazier. I don’t understand why more alumni don’t donate but that’s not likely to change without a creative campaign so make the kids put up $2,000 year (they pay $783 now but it should be even higher if they’re from out of state) It’s only 4 years of that compared to a lifetime of relying on alumni for everything.

There is a lot of that in this country. You want someone else to pay for your entertainment. Well MY opinion is that those who want that entertainmentn should pay. Why should someone who has no interest in sports or football in particular be bound to pay for our entertainment.

Because it’s your duty as a student to help fund athletics (I don’t mean NIL payments to players) and the school as a whole. Most students are only there because of the notoriety the school received because of football wins. It improved everything from new buildings and better students. Personally, I’d rather the school use funds elsewhere but they’re not taking endowment dollars to improve athletics, so the students should fall in line next. Alumni SHOULD donate more but that’s another discussion.

A student has no "duty" lol...they aren't a solider. Yes athletic success has increased the University's notoriety but it's not the responsibility of the student to fund something that is arguably superfluous.

If you're watching the games and on this blog you're invested personally in the success of the program. Why wouldn't you put your money where you mouth is to see it succeed? If you don't then what right do you have to complain?

[Howard Street Hooligan]

It is not the responsibility of the STUDENTS to pay for athletics in this way. Rather ticket sales (which should be increased with an NIL ear mark like Tennessee did), sponsorship, donations and internal revenue (TV, concessions, apparel, licensing agreements).

I believe we should do the following
1. Increase ticket prices & add an NIL fee to each ticket.
2. Increase messaging on all platforms that giving to YC, even a little, is important. Get former athletes to shoot video spots and post on social media. We have an incredible video team, get them involved.
3. Fund the YC so it can raise money effectively. Ask any alumni less than 40 if they EVER get asked for money directly...they haven't
4. Expand licensing agreements so the brand it's self can make money.

That’s your opinion but I believe the students should be funding a good portion, especially when we know damn well a small mountain town isn’t going to draw massive brand exposure like a university in a major city. Asking alumni to ALWAYS fund everything is crazier. I don’t understand why more alumni don’t donate but that’s not likely to change without a creative campaign so make the kids put up $2,000 year (they pay $783 now but it should be even higher if they’re from out of state) It’s only 4 years of that compared to a lifetime of relying on alumni for everything.

There is a lot of that in this country. You want someone else to pay for your entertainment. Well MY opinion is that those who want that entertainmentn should pay. Why should someone who has no interest in sports or football in particular be bound to pay for our entertainment.

Because it’s your duty as a student to help fund athletics (I don’t mean NIL payments to players) and the school as a whole. Most students are only there because of the notoriety the school received because of football wins. It improved everything from new buildings and better students. Personally, I’d rather the school use funds elsewhere but they’re not taking endowment dollars to improve athletics, so the students should fall in line next. Alumni SHOULD donate more but that’s another discussion.

A student has no "duty" lol...they aren't a solider. Yes athletic success has increased the University's notoriety but it's not the responsibility of the student to fund something that is arguably superfluous.

If you're watching the games and on this blog you're invested personally in the success of the program. Why wouldn't you put your money where you mouth is to see it succeed? If you don't then what right do you have to complain?

Again, the STUDENT should pay more than they’re currently paying but ALUMNI should as well. If you’re going to go to the school then sorry, a few thousand should go towards athletics a year. Our alumni don’t give money and I don’t see that changing dramatically anytime soon so students, it’s on you while
at school. Maybe it will encourage them to KEEP giving down the road. Idk. The school should invest more of its own dollars too.

I donate but we have very little fans compared to big schools so EVERYONE needs to chip in and that includes the students while they’re in school. Bump it up, DG.

[hotrod2001]

Doug Gillin

The transfer portal. That and NIL have ruined college sports. There is no loyalty, no incentive to build something up, it's a scourge serving literally two conferences at the expense of everyone else.